Talk:iuvenis

Any citations for use of IUVENIS as noun meaning "young woman"? Have only ever seen it used to refer to males. Apollo Opifer (talk) 18:32, 27 May 2013 (UTC) Apollo Opifer

• That's too difficult for me to find. But it is a neuter noun, so I assume it can refer to both men and women. SemperBlotto (talk) 18:51, 27 May 2013 (UTC)
• See Lewis & Smart entry at Perseus for citations ([1]) Chuck Entz (talk) 20:45, 27 May 2013 (UTC)

"iuvenis" as plural accusative

"iuvenis" as plural accusative exists? I mean, Perseus has it.--Yoshiciv (talk) 12:52, 21 August 2018 (UTC)

@Yoshiciv: That's possible, -īs is an archaic ending attested for other words. Per utramque cavernam 12:56, 21 August 2018 (UTC)

@Yoshiciv, Per utramque cavernam: Accusative plural -īs is regular in the third declension, especially if there is an ablative singular in -ī or genitive plural in -ium, and should be included by default in declension templates more; in fact it is in one of the tables already, as seen in carnālis; even senex as seen on zh:senex. Some authors even use it more than -ēs, particularly in silver latinity (for example Augustus). I can’t tell you exactly the limits how much one can predict it; that there are two endings stems from the Old Latin confounding of two consonantal declensions, one directly consonantal and one with i (which distinction is well-known in verbs). Fay Freak (talk) 13:30, 21 August 2018 (UTC)

RFV discussion: January–February 2024

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iuvenis

Latin. Request for verification of neuter adjective nominative/accusative forms (iuvenis and iuvenia). "Iuvenia" is I think attestable, but late; I am more skeptical of "iuvenis" (vs. "iuvene"?) and suspect that in practice a neuter singular is not really used. Urszag (talk) 03:31, 16 January 2024 (UTC)

I've updated the citations page with 2 examples of "iuvenia" and one of "iuvena" for the neuter nom/acc plural. For the neuter nom/acc singular, I found two texts that use "iuvene"; I can't find any examples of "iuvenis" for this form yet. Also, I see that the Latin, Portuguese, and Russian Wiktionaries already give "iuvene" for this form.--Urszag (talk) 04:20, 20 January 2024 (UTC)

neuter "iuvene" and "iuvenia" are now clearly attested. However, I see no evidence of these forms existing in Classical Latin (or at any time near it, e.g. in Christian Imperial Latin: the first citation for "iuvenia" is from 1204 and the first for neuter nom/acc "iuvene" is from 1719). I have added a usage note stating that in Classical Latin, the word did not have a separate adjectival declension; rather, the noun forms were used with the sense of an adjective (in formal terms, equivalent to an appositive construction, despite the adjectival sense). Neuter nom/acc "iuvenis" remains unattested. I plan to remove it once this RFV has passed for a month without an example.--Urszag (talk) 05:12, 2 February 2024 (UTC)

RFV Failed for neuter singular nom/acc "iuvenis". I removed it from the entry. For the forms attested only in postclassical Latin, such as iuvenia, I removed them from the declension table but included a mention in the usage notes.--Urszag (talk) 14:58, 16 February 2024 (UTC)