Talk:毛主席

RfD

The following information passed a request for deletion.

This discussion is no longer live and is left here as an archive. Please do not modify this conversation, but feel free to discuss its conclusions.

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Mandarin for "Chairman Mao". As a specific entity/title combination, this fails to meet WT:CFI. --EncycloPetey 04:39, 4 August 2009 (UTC)

10,000,000 google hits, a common term and we should have it. While the English translation may seem unnecessary to English-speaking natives, an American trying to read a Chinese text that includes the term 毛主席 needs to be able to look it up in a dictionary just like any other Chinese term. —Stephen 06:07, 4 August 2009 (UTC)

indeed!![i'dwish mONOLITHIC ENGLISH NATIVSPEAKERS'd'vMOREMPHATY!!!![nCFIneedsVASTLY EXPANDED,we alno thisisaMAMOTHproject fromstartez,ifnolike,WOTHE HEL IS1DOIN'HERE?!?--史凡>voice-MSN/skypeme!RSI>typin=hard! 02:55, 5 September 2009 (UTC)

So, we should have George W. Bush, because there are a lot of hits and becuase a foreigner trying to read an English text that includes the term "needs to be able to look it up in a dictionary just like any other term"? Sorry, but those arguments have never been part of our criteria for inclusion. --EncycloPetey 15:41, 4 August 2009 (UTC)

VERYMUCHSO,INDEED!!CULTURAL REFmakeSTUDYIN'THE TARGETLANGUAG HARD,even4me [w/engl]as basicalyA DIALECT SPEAKER,flemish--hel,even w/DUTCHtexts i'd'v thisprob[asNOTmy culture,idontno their actreses undundund>1.line linguistic resours=dict here need2say"W-u.s.-pres.2000-8,bro of+ref2wp",easy,nice,clean'n'HELPFL2USER--urCFIwereDEAD-WRONG SINCE INCEPTION,n its OVERDUE[sinsu guys like2interpret'emALA LETTRE[dc's arbitrary side-takin'apart]like abunch oflil'kids inkindy{"the cfi-teacher said"},orbrainwashed"this is a{trad.} dict.{cryinvois}"-adults] 2THOROUGHLY REWRIT'EM,or atleastREALIZE THT ALL PROPERNAMES [N SOPs asoon as a/1SINGL USER'D BENIFIT fromit]needINCLUSION instedev usin'wt as ur PRIVATPLAYGROUND[cantu erect ur ownclub4/2thatpurpose?-imhere2help get wt2itsGOAL=UNIVERSAL RESOURS4theLANGUAG-QUERYIN'partevHUMANITY,most ofwhich'DNOT CARE LES'bout althe"howmany angels dancin'ona needltip"scholastic 'n'obstructin'altercations here,laced w/an overdose evsophistry'n'falacious reasonin'just4"goodmeasure"soitseems.--史凡>voice-MSN/skypeme!RSI>typin=hard! 03:27, 5 September 2009 (UTC)

Should be treated eaqually without discrimination whether Máo zhǔxí, Confucius, Mencius, Lenin, Stalin, etc.

And Shakespeare, this seems to be a policy issue rather than a single deletion request. Probably requires some sort of vote, rather than just keeping or deleting this entry. Mglovesfun (talk) 20:37, 5 August 2009 (UTC)

indeed!!--史凡>voice-MSN/skypeme!RSI>typin=hard! 03:27, 5 September 2009 (UTC)

Shakespeare is at least claiming attirbutive use, which for me makes it meet WT:CFI. I'd happily delete the others as "names of specific entries with no other lexical merit. Mglovesfun (talk) 12:15, 8 August 2009 (UTC)

I'd at least keep Confucius out of that list, since the corpus of his works is also referred to by that name. I think the principle there is that works of certain authors come to be so well known, that they are referred to by the name (or part of the name) of that author. "I was reading Ovid last night." "I couldn't understand the language of the original Chaucer." "My copy of Sophocles is falling apart." We've had that particular conversation before, although I don't recall which particular author's name was under discussion. --EncycloPetey 04:10, 20 August 2009 (UTC)

Oppose If it were simply "a chairman named Mao", then I would agree. While that is surely the etymology, it also more specifically means Mao Zedong. Thus it is not simply a sum of parts and has a specific lexical meaning that is not necessarily apparent without a definition. 118.103.10.2 02:45, 24 August 2009 (UTC)

Should have Bush, with a definition that refers to George W., but not George W. Bush specifically. Should have Jefferson, referring to the historically important Jeffersons such as Thomas, and Washington referring to the important Washingtons. But those are English names and not at all the same sort of term as 毛主席. For a Chinese term such as 毛主席, we need a definition of the full term, not just part of it the way we can do with many similar English terms. You are trying to judge Chinese terms by their definition rather than the term itself, which is an elementary error. It’s the reason that we cannot look up a common Chinese term such as 成龙 (Chéng Lóng]] here. —Stephen 03:03, 24 August 2009 (UTC)

requester has NO idea bout chin.[onliLIMITEDview of CFI<presumably short4CHRIST!F*INTRIES!]yet demands DEL-am i the only1 who thinks such is INCONGRUOUS, HILARIOUS n PLAINLY WEIRD?!?as they say in flemish:"schoenmaker,blijft bij uw leest". ps names/woteva USERSneed oughtbeINCLUDED!npl,FAKattr-use,good4nuttin wishwash,if onli such"contributors" 'dHoudini-away'emselvs[beterstil:'dput inaPOSITIVefet:)='dbe a GIANT LEAP4wt,but'elas, justnILUSIONmonvieux..--史凡>voice-MSN/skypeme!RSI>typin=hard! 07:17, 24 August 2009 (UTC)

Keep. Allow me (despite the fact that I don't speak any variety of Chinese) to put this into perspective for people who know nothing about Chinese (yes, I know that me saying that seems kind of odd since I know almost nothing either but I digress). Let's say that one day in one country in which some antagonistic group were oppressing people. One day a "hero" arose and put a stop to their antics. Let's just call this hero "Kiyoshi Tsukasamoto"(random idea there; no special reason why I chose that aside from the fact that I just felt like stringing together a Japanese name). It doesn't stop there though; the antagonists still trouble the people but the hero still continues to guard the people and drive away the opposing forces until they finally give up (or are decimated; whichever you prefer ;).

Now jump forward many, many years to when he dies. Even when after death the people who he saved still remember him. Perhaps during his lifetime people came to refer to him by a special name as a term of the deep respect they held (and still hold) for him. Something like "Kiyoshi the Pure/True/Just/etc. or Guardian Kiyoshi. This "Chairman Mao" is a term like the ones I used in my story, especially the second one. Finally, the last thing I'll say is IMO real terms like these should be included in Wiktionary. 50 Xylophone Players talk 19:46, 4 September 2009 (UTC)

Palk-ta![darn input-prob ofmine..--史凡>voice-MSN/skypeme!RSI>typin=hard! 02:55, 5 September 2009 (UTC) Kept per discussion above. Mglovesfun (talk) 17:08, 5 November 2009 (UTC)