Template talk:izh-decl/patsas

Gradation

@Thadh is this template made specifically for words without gradation or is it just incomplete yet? --KirillW (talk) 16:47, 28 April 2021 (UTC)

@KirillW: Junus doesn't use gradation on patsas-type words AFAICT (so ahas > ahaat). The only exception that I could find is kalakas-type words (with kk > k gradation), but correct me if I'm wrong. Thadh (talk) 16:53, 28 April 2021 (UTC)

@Thadh: Unless we consider lammas or hammas a different declension, these are the plentiful examples (including p. 25 in Grammatikka). On ahas see Inkeroisen Keelen Oppikirja p. 36: Eivät hailit pääse pois läpi verkonsilmän ahtaan. I'm also pretty much sure that I've seen other examples of -s words with consonant gradation in Junus' books. Do you have examples where this is not the case?

Also I've just noticed an example of inconsistency specifically for patsas: in Loonnontiito translated by Molodtsova there's patsaja (PTV:PL) at page 20 --KirillW (talk) 17:48, 28 April 2021 (UTC)

@KirillW: Good, I'll fix the template in that case. I don't know why Molodtsova would use -aja- instead of -atia-, but perhaps (since she probably spoke Soikkola) it's a typo from some dialectal -ahia- > -aja-? In any case, thanks for the feedback! Thadh (talk) 18:20, 28 April 2021 (UTC)

@Thadh: It's likely a dialectal form. Mehmet says that PTV:PL varies most of all cases between speakers. --KirillW (talk) 18:32, 28 April 2021 (UTC)

@KirillW: I've fixed the template and seiväs (forgot it gradated p>v). Funny how the literary Ingrian's declension is almost identical to Finnish, while dialectal declensions are very different :) Thadh (talk) 18:43, 28 April 2021 (UTC)