Wiktionary:Requests for verification archive/2011/more

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misc 1[edit]


Do we allow HTML tags and other syntax to be part of our dictionary? (test rendered as <b><i><u>test</b></i></u>) If so, should they be verified as being in common use, and how should they be used? At the end, the beginning, or the middle of a clause or statement? And is this the correct entry to use, or should it be relegated to the unsupported titles appendix instead, where it can use the < and > tags in the title? TeleComNasSprVen 23:23, 28 February 2011 (UTC)

Entry looks really wrong; if it were actually in use and attestable as such we'd keep it, but I can't imagine it's the case. HTML isn't considered to be any 'language' so it doesn't meet CFI, but it's claiming to be humorous use (in English) of faux-HTML. But... nah. Mglovesfun (talk) 23:47, 28 February 2011 (UTC)
Based on the Web page listed in the entry's References section, the pagetitle is correct (sans angle brackets). This is not an HTML tag, but something (if our entry — and said Web page — is correct) people use to tag their sentences to indicate sarcasm online. (Compare, though the analogies are imperfect, quote used to tag a quotation, and
-) used to tag something lighthearted.) It is English and carries meaning, so seems to be inclusible if verifiable.​—msh210 (talk) 07:41, 1 March 2011 (UTC)
I've heard the same for strikethroughs (as in "I did not mean to say that"). TeleComNasSprVen 05:51, 3 March 2011 (UTC)
It shouldn't be in NS:0 if it's an unsupported title. Mglovesfun (talk) 12:20, 5 March 2011 (UTC)
I have no problem with it, as long as it's used in running English text. DAVilla 06:25, 12 March 2011 (UTC)
RFV-failed. - -sche (discuss) 07:05, 8 August 2011 (UTC)


haven't seen this one so far -- Prince Kassad 15:10, 5 May 2011 (UTC)

Neither have I and I do do a lot of online chatting. JamesjiaoTC 04:08, 6 May 2011 (UTC)
RFV-failed. - -sche (discuss) 21:50, 21 August 2011 (UTC)

free reed instrument[edit]

See steel guitar above, but ask anyone familiar with free reed instruments. --Lo Ximiendo 15:51, 22 June 2011 (UTC)


Some person who made this in Vietnam might have some motive. --Lo Ximiendo 06:55, 23 June 2011 (UTC)

Might, perhaps. But a request here makes only sense if there is some content that could be verified. Here, some IP (geolocated in Vietnam) created a new page, claiming this to be an English (!) adjective, with the meaning "Of or pertaining to [[{{{1}}}]]". Judging from the incoming links, the word has a meaning in some language but this is not the place for random guesswork. Bring it to the appropriate requested entries page. -- Gauss 07:29, 23 June 2011 (UTC)


The person who created it came from New Zealand. --Lo Ximiendo 07:42, 23 June 2011 (UTC)

Sorry, what kind of request is this? The entry contains nothing except the vague claim this might be an English noun. In particular, no possible sense of clee was indicated that could be verified here. The provenance of the "creating" IP is not relevant to the subject. -- Gauss 08:09, 23 June 2011 (UTC)


Tooironic, what part of speech is this word? --Lo Ximiendo 00:43, 13 July 2011 (UTC)

It's a noun. I added it already. ---> Tooironic 00:00, 15 July 2011 (UTC)


Tooironic, I have another request again; it's the same as last time for the word that's about some food. --Lo Ximiendo 05:36, 14 July 2011 (UTC)

It might not be "nevermind", but this [1] explains the word. --Lo Ximiendo 05:56, 14 July 2011 (UTC)
It's definitely a real word, but the definition is a copyright violation. Fixed it now, striking. ---> Tooironic 00:57, 15 July 2011 (UTC)


I'm seeing a couple transitive uses in Google News, but nothing to indicate that there's a different transitive meaning, or even that those uses aren't simple mistakes. I put one in an HTML comment, since I didn't think it supported the sense. Furthermore the current example sentence implies a far more specialized usage then the definition offers.--Prosfilaes 02:49, 1 March 2011 (UTC)

RFV-failed. - -sche (discuss) 07:30, 28 September 2011 (UTC)


Any takers? SemperBlotto 17:06, 2 March 2011 (UTC)

Seeing a bunch of mentions and even some uses for a "handsome, neat, orderly" and even "good" sense (for farrantly (current redlink) more, but also possibly sufficiently many for farrant or especially the older farande), but none for the RFVed sense of "short, brief".​—msh210 (talk) 20:17, 2 March 2011 (UTC)

Definitely a Surrey slang, but perhaps only in recent usage (4 years or so), what is the Wiktionary stance on that kind of thing? Maybe better as an Urban Dictionary entry? —This comment was unsigned.

Needs written attestation. Sometimes local words like this are only ever spoken, and we can't document that. Wiktionary is a written project. Mglovesfun (talk) 12:12, 3 March 2011 (UTC)
RFV-failed. - -sche (discuss) 07:30, 28 September 2011 (UTC)

mak su[edit]

English: a dish. I see three Web hits for "eat mak su", all of which capitalize it as Mak Su. There are other senses on bgc, whihc makes it a little hard to search for. (They may well be transliterations, though.)​—msh210 (talk) 20:49, 2 March 2011 (UTC)

RFV-failed. - -sche (discuss) 07:30, 28 September 2011 (UTC)


I have added a quotation to Jawjah/Jawjuh — from 1867! I can however not find quotations of Lanner. - -sche 02:24, 8 March 2011 (UTC)

RFV-failed. - -sche (discuss) 07:30, 28 September 2011 (UTC)


Does this word exist in English outside of Urban Dictionary? Rspeer 06:27, 8 March 2011 (UTC)

RFV failed. Equinox 13:54, 7 October 2011 (UTC)


There is a mention at [2], initial Google Book search shows only hits for grolies (Dutch, I assume). Mglovesfun (talk) 20:55, 8 March 2011 (UTC)

RFV-failed. - -sche (discuss) 00:04, 6 October 2011 (UTC)


Normal for Norfolk. Same source as above. Mglovesfun (talk) 20:59, 8 March 2011 (UTC)

RFV-failed. - -sche (discuss) 00:04, 6 October 2011 (UTC)


Good looking mum. Same source as above. Mglovesfun (talk) 20:59, 8 March 2011 (UTC)

RFV-failed. - -sche (discuss) 00:04, 6 October 2011 (UTC)


No hits for google books:"got an|a ubi on|to" or same on ggc. As this is by our new friend Polaisz, who's been adding a lot of these, that's the extent of my effort.​—msh210 (talk) 21:12, 8 March 2011 (UTC)

  • I think you'll find that he's an old friend. SemperBlotto 22:21, 8 March 2011 (UTC)
RFV-failed. - -sche (discuss) 00:07, 6 October 2011 (UTC)


From RfD. Most cites listed are mere mentions. -- Prince Kassad 19:16, 11 March 2011 (UTC)

Existing cites entered by a user apparently with same name as cited author. I can't find any durably archived cites at our usual sources. There is a Scholar cite by the same author, but it doesn't seem durably archived. "Educacide", though not necessarily with the same meaning, gets some hits. DCDuring TALK 19:29, 11 March 2011 (UTC)
Failed RFV. Equinox 13:53, 7 October 2011 (UTC)

prisoner of war[edit]

adjective: head word and usex show prisoner-of-war. Mglovesfun (talk) 01:52, 19 March 2011 (UTC)

Adjective RFV-failed, noun kept. - -sche (discuss) 04:25, 31 August 2011 (UTC)


Rfv-sense: Swedish "the self". Mglovesfun (talk) 11:42, 19 March 2011 (UTC)

Yes, this Swedish noun is listed in SAOL, the current standard for spelling. I've added the reference to the entry. --LA2 22:06, 21 March 2011 (UTC)
Shall it pass because it is clearly in widespread use? - -sche (discuss) 01:14, 14 July 2011 (UTC)
Oh, hm. Read this. Looks like more research into the matter is needed. I know a Swede on de.Wikt I may ask. - -sche (discuss) 18:27, 18 August 2011 (UTC)
I believe I have cited this as a noun, by looking for instances of "självets" (according to the Swedish Wiktionary entry, neither the adjective nor the pronoun inflect into a form ending in -ets, but according to our entry, the noun does). - -sche (discuss) 06:21, 23 August 2011 (UTC)


Definitely a song title, but searching for "his cabinessence" yields no hits on Groups or Books. But a further search may be productive.​—msh210 (talk) 18:13, 31 March 2011 (UTC)

"Well-known work"? Or is that reserved for only a special meaning of "well-known"? DCDuring TALK 19:26, 31 March 2011 (UTC)
The latter.  :-) ​—msh210 (talk) 19:31, 31 March 2011 (UTC)
The only hits on Google book search are "mentions". I can't find any usage beyond the Beach Boys record. SemperBlotto 13:31, 26 May 2011 (UTC)

Failed; deleted.​—msh210 (talk) 18:30, 2 October 2011 (UTC)


No hits on Google Books [3]. ---> Tooironic 01:22, 30 May 2011 (UTC)

Speedy deleted - no corresponding character entries. JamesjiaoTC 01:32, 10 October 2011 (UTC)
Yes, the "no corresponding character entries" should be the reason for speedy deletion. In Wiktionary:Votes/2011-07/Pinyin_entries there's a clause: "whenever we have an entry for a traditional-characters or simplified-characters spelling.". There are still plenty of pinyin entries in the old format, easier deleted than fixed, if you ask me. --Anatoli 01:37, 10 October 2011 (UTC)


No hits on GoogleBooks. [4]. ---> Tooironic 01:24, 30 May 2011 (UTC)

I dare say most if not all pinyin entries would not have any google hits, as they are simply not used in literature (unless one that specifically deals with pinyin). The phrase 火葬, however, is a common term. I think ddpy (aka 123abc, even though he doesn't admit it himself)'s reasoning behind including pinyin terms is to make it convenient for people, not whether they are attestable in books. I don't have too much of a problem with that, except he doesn't create the corresponding character entries for the pinyin entries that he creates... - but I guess that's an issue for another topic. JamesjiaoTC 01:40, 30 May 2011 (UTC)
Toned pinyin entries are not disallowed but they should not encouraged (toneless pinyin entries is not allowed), so applying the attestability check is a method to restrain the flood of pinyin entries without character entries. The purpose of pinyin is to help learners to pronounce Mandarin words correctly, not to replace the writing system. Entries kaishi, kāishǐ (I added the 2nd etymology recently) make the work on the true Chinese entries duplicated - 開始 / 开始, 開駛, 开驶, creating a mess and inconsistency. I see no value and they are not citable, delete. (I have deleted the Mandarin section of kaishi - toneless)--Anatoli 06:17, 31 May 2011 (UTC)
  • Toned Pinyin entries are allowed and they should encouraged. They have value, please see Wenlin Pinyin dictionary. 13:08, 5 June 2011 (UTC)
    • Whether or not you think something has value is beside the point. Entries must pass Wiktionary's CFI. Anyway, even if someone were to type in toned pinyin (which is impossible to do without copying and pasting from another source anyway!) they could still find the entry under its hanzi equivalent. By the way we know you are User:123abc and have blocked you on the multiple accounts you are abusing under, so really your input is not required. ---> Tooironic 00:43, 6 June 2011 (UTC)
Keep if attestable. Otherwise don't. 'Nuff said. Mglovesfun (talk) 20:49, 31 May 2011 (UTC)
Speedy deleted - no corresponding character entries. JamesjiaoTC 01:33, 10 October 2011 (UTC)


Paper aeroplane. Nothing in Google Books/Groups. Alt spelling paperflyer also seems suspect, but it's somebody's user name on a newsgroup so harder to narrow down. Equinox 15:58, 30 May 2011 (UTC)

Failed RFV. Equinox 11:41, 11 September 2011 (UTC)


To put in a folder (in a computer system). I googled around and found nothing. Equinox 18:30, 30 May 2011 (UTC)

Failed RFV. Equinox 11:42, 11 September 2011 (UTC)


RReally? SemperBlotto 22:14, 14 February 2011 (UTC)

Looks like a good use of WT:BRAND, as do the similar following terms. DCDuring TALK 03:44, 15 February 2011 (UTC)
RFV-failed. - -sche (discuss) 05:09, 12 October 2011 (UTC)


Does this really meet our CFI? SemperBlotto 22:16, 14 February 2011 (UTC)

RFV-failed. - -sche (discuss) 05:09, 12 October 2011 (UTC)


Rfv-sense noun - rock-climbing. Looks like it might be a verb, but is difficult to check. SemperBlotto 22:20, 14 February 2011 (UTC)

Resolved. Wikipedia has this at w:Edging as a noun, so I moved it there. - -sche (discuss) 02:30, 14 October 2011 (UTC)

spectrum typology[edit]

Any takers? SemperBlotto 14:56, 18 February 2011 (UTC)

The users two other entries phrasal typology and rhetorical device could use some cleanup. Mglovesfun (talk) 16:43, 18 February 2011 (UTC)
RFV-failed spectrum typology. The other two seem to be valid, and the definitions have been improved. - -sche (discuss) 03:11, 14 October 2011 (UTC)


Rfv-sense: "(comics} Famous Disney's dog." No citations at present to support WT:FICTION, or WT:BRAND or that usage actual presumes Disney connection. "Famous dog" should be easy, based on cites that meet WT:FICTION and WT:BRAND. DCDuring TALK 20:13, 19 February 2011 (UTC)

Some definition line that merely pointed to Wikipedia might work. DCDuring TALK 20:16, 19 February 2011 (UTC)
No citations in the entry, as far as I can see. RFV-fails. - -sche (discuss) 00:06, 18 August 2011 (UTC)

syntexis [edit]

Rfv-senses emaciation and wasp SemperBlotto 08:18, 22 February 2011 (UTC)

"emaciation" sense appears in a medical dictionary. DCDuring TALK 11:52, 22 February 2011 (UTC)
Yes - I've found it now. SemperBlotto 12:02, 22 February 2011 (UTC)
RFV-passed: RFV withdrawn by nominator, and I added one citation to each sense. - -sche (discuss) 05:17, 12 October 2011 (UTC)


I split this entry from syntexis. There does appear to be a one-species genus, a type of sawfly or woodwasp. DCDuring TALK 11:52, 22 February 2011 (UTC)

That's OK too. SemperBlotto 12:02, 22 February 2011 (UTC)
RFV-passed: RFV apparently withdrawn by nominator, and I can indeed find it on Google Books. - -sche (discuss) 05:17, 12 October 2011 (UTC)


Adjective: (US sports) substituted (so has to sit on the bench)

Past participle, not adjective. See Wiktionary:English adjectives and bench#Verb. DCDuring TALK 13:05, 4 May 2011 (UTC)

The definition we have is "(US, sports) substituted (so has to sit on the bench)". A more general sense of "sitting on the sidelines" sees an 1830(!) cite: [5]. [[Wiktionary:English adjectives]] includes the following test: "Can it modify a noun in attributive position (before the noun)? Only adjectives and nouns can." Is that accurate? Does a benched player not use benched as a past participle? If it is accurate, then there are sufficiently many cites (search for "a benched player").​—msh210 (talk) 15:54, 4 May 2011 (UTC)
O the irony. --Mglovesfun (talk) 16:04, 4 May 2011 (UTC)
Indeed. The many (???) authors and readers of the page seem to have missed that.
We could say that "adjective" functions can be performed by words of many types, but the lexicographic class at Wiktionary is reserved for words meeting some specific criteria designed to prevent needless and hard-to-maintain duplicative content, without doing too much violence to the understandings of language professionals or, especially, normal users. I'm no language professional and viewed Wiktionary:English adjectives as a draft to be improved in the wiki way by others. What it is the customary way of distinguishing adjective as functional role and as lexicographic category? Is there another way to look at it that makes it all clear? DCDuring TALK 19:34, 4 May 2011 (UTC)
Deleted and striking. It does seem redundant to the verb by our tests. Equinox 15:22, 18 December 2011 (UTC)


A few Google hits, but the definitions given don't seem to actually mean much. SemperBlotto 21:07, 15 May 2011 (UTC)

Looks like the noun should pass with some definition or another, but the verb, looks unlikely. Mglovesfun (talk) 21:18, 15 May 2011 (UTC)


The following members of Category:HTML have been nominated for verification, presumably as they are listed as English, though in reality, they aren't. Listed in subsections as follows:


Mglovesfun (talk) 11:50, 16 May 2011 (UTC)


Mglovesfun (talk) 11:50, 16 May 2011 (UTC)


Mglovesfun (talk) 11:50, 16 May 2011 (UTC)


Mglovesfun (talk) 11:50, 16 May 2011 (UTC)


Mglovesfun (talk) 11:50, 16 May 2011 (UTC)

google groups:"an|a|the nbsp after|before|in" suffices to show use in English. Someone with knowledge of what collocates to use in other Usenet-popular languages can run a similar search for them.​—msh210 (talk) 16:47, 19 May 2011 (UTC)
I suggest changing the language header to translingual. It's not really English.--Dmol 08:37, 18 May 2011 (UTC)
That's an excellent first step; the second issue, for me, I'm not the original tagger, that was Hippietrail in 2007, the second question is are these words in any language? Do they convey meaning for a human reader? Granted that's purely an RFD issue. Mglovesfun (talk) 23:11, 18 May 2011 (UTC)
I think that these are purely English initialisms, acronyms and abbreviations. Nbsp, for example stands for the English words non-breaking space (c.f. the nbsp character), and surely not any other words in any other languages. The unicode then ends with a semicolon, much like how the period is a stopper to the end of a sentence. TeleComNasSprVen 01:07, 19 May 2011 (UTC)
If you want to find citations for these in English, go ahead. --Mglovesfun (talk) 15:43, 19 May 2011 (UTC)
Not in that form, it isn't [6]. The attested versions of the term in the link always have an ampersand preceding the term and a semicolon following it, even though they are declarations of the unicode character. Having them treat it as a single form, however, would mean that nbsp needs to be changed to "&nbsp;" as an entry title. TeleComNasSprVen 00:29, 20 May 2011 (UTC)
Again, could that be attested in English with any sort of 'meaning'? Is it a noun, or what? --Mglovesfun (talk) 13:43, 20 May 2011 (UTC)
It's like the literally thousands of keywords in computer programming languages. Not dict material. Equinox 15:29, 20 May 2011 (UTC)
Should be moved to WT:RFD. Used as jargons by a very limited group of people who deal with programming on a regular basis. Next thing you know people will start including common SQL commands like DBCC, sp_who and etc... JamesjiaoTC 04:19, 30 May 2011 (UTC)
Did no one notice the link I posted above to a list of sufficiently many hits, without ampersands, in running English text, of this term?​—msh210 (talk) 06:44, 30 May 2011 (UTC)
[[nbsp]] passes RFV. - -sche (discuss) 19:44, 24 October 2011 (UTC)
Failed the others. Equinox 15:50, 18 December 2011 (UTC)


"Of greater quality or merit." Not in Chambers, although that does have our example of Protestant Work Ethic, saying it is associated with the religious movement and not with any generic sense. Equinox 19:56, 25 May 2011 (UTC)

RFV-failed. - -sche (discuss) 07:51, 15 August 2011 (UTC)


"The love of small places." Nowt in Google Books. Equinox 18:50, 27 May 2011 (UTC)

Google Groups only has it as a definition in word lists, and HathiTrust only gives one hit, to Sex crimes and paraphilia, 2006, but doesn't even give a snippet view, only that it's on page 91.--Prosfilaes 23:06, 27 May 2011 (UTC)
Failed RFV. Equinox 15:15, 18 December 2011 (UTC)


Noun: those who are believed to be without a right to use, through tenancy, ownership or license, any improved residential real property such as buildings, huts or other structures intended for human habitation; the unhoused.

Is it used? Is this the def? Context? Is there an associated adjective sense? Is the noun usage just a normal use of an adjective as a noun (fused head?)? Is it really synonymous with unhoused as a noun? DCDuring TALK 14:51, 1 June 2011 (UTC)
Added by a new user Brothercanyouspareadime (talkcontribs), me feeling is that it's just plain wrong. --Mglovesfun (talk) 11:14, 2 June 2011 (UTC)
Failed RFV. Equinox 15:14, 18 December 2011 (UTC)


Sense 3 for the noun on this page refers to the NASA spacecraft, but I would have thought this was only found capitalised as Aqua or AQUA. Caladon 09:24, 3 June 2011 (UTC)

Yes. Nor is it a common noun. Should be deleted. Equinox 10:59, 5 September 2011 (UTC)
Failed RFV. Equinox 15:12, 18 December 2011 (UTC)

in the driver seat[edit]

Possibly a variant of in the driver's seat. I'll try to attest it later, if no one beats me to it. --Daniel 16:15, 9 June 2011 (UTC)

I have heard of driver's seat and driving-seat but not driver seat. Equinox 23:50, 10 June 2011 (UTC)
I would write it "in the driver's seat". Much to my amazement, in various google searches drivers seat/drivers' seat is more common (sometimes much more common) than either. driver's seat is the least common form. Adding "in the" doesn't change anything.DCDuring TALK 01:07, 11 June 2011 (UTC)
Failed RFV. Equinox 15:11, 18 December 2011 (UTC)


Interjection "used to accuse someone of being a moekko" (whatever that is). Really English? And really an interjection? (Saying "Idiot!" or "Pervert!" is using a noun for example, not an intj.) Equinox 21:03, 11 June 2011 (UTC)

Failed RFV. Removing intj. Equinox 18:50, 13 November 2011 (UTC)


Supposed Latin verb. Not in any Latin dictionary I can find. SemperBlotto 06:45, 12 June 2011 (UTC)

And if the creator doesn't specify a conjugation, we only have this form to work with. --Mglovesfun (talk) 10:09, 13 June 2011 (UTC)


A kind of spam. This is one of those words that was invented recently, blogged to death, and mentioned a zillion times without really being used. CFI-compatible citations would be nice. Equinox 21:07, 19 June 2011 (UTC)

Failed RFV. Equinox 23:57, 28 September 2011 (UTC)


Only in dictionaries. Nadando 13:50, 21 June 2011 (UTC)

Failed RFV. Equinox 23:58, 28 September 2011 (UTC)


I don't know if it's made up but I never use something like that, honestly, when I type on the forums. --Lo Ximiendo 17:59, 23 June 2011 (UTC)

Cited and moved to IDGAS. —Internoob 21:36, 6 September 2011 (UTC)
Striking: entry was moved and this form no longer exists. Equinox 15:05, 18 December 2011 (UTC)


(furry jargon, interrogative) “Anyone willing/desiring to have sex?”, and “Are you willing/desiring to have sex?” Equinox 15:34, 24 June 2011 (UTC)

I think this is just a shortening of a phrase, not a seperate sense. You could ask someone 'Sandwich?' in much the same way. —CodeCat 18:05, 24 June 2011 (UTC)
Failed RFV. Equinox 15:03, 18 December 2011 (UTC)


Three senses, all slang and all highly dubious. "1. an annoying user of a bulletin board etc. 2. yellow snow. 3. troll who preys in spiritual chat rooms, forums, etc, getting the title snert. snot nosed egotistical religious twit." Equinox 20:47, 24 June 2011 (UTC)

Failed RFV. Equinox 15:02, 18 December 2011 (UTC)


"Used within the British Army in response to an answer to an obvious question. This is a question that you have set the other person up to answer. Can become quite frustrating as you become paranoid answering any question in case it is a Wah!" Equinox 16:44, 26 June 2011 (UTC)

The wording is certainly too informal; I agree that attestation is the best place to start with rewording a definition like this. --Mglovesfun (talk) 11:34, 28 June 2011 (UTC)
Failed RFV. Equinox 15:01, 18 December 2011 (UTC)


"A pot into which baristas eject used espresso grounds with a vigorous smashing motion." See Talk:smashpot from 2004, and note that Google still has nothing on this most of a decade later. Equinox 21:36, 26 June 2011 (UTC)

Failed RFV. Equinox 14:59, 18 December 2011 (UTC)

do it up[edit]

"To do something, usually with purpose." Ultimateria 21:44, 28 June 2011 (UTC)

The lemma should be do up or do something up or do someone up. At "do up", MWOnline has a few senses relating to clothing or hair, "prepare", "fasten", "can/preserve", and "exhaust". bgc has usage of a sense related to sex, possibly "beat someone up" and "scold/berate someone". Our entry for do up needs to be done up right. DCDuring TALK 23:47, 28 June 2011 (UTC)
Just delete it. Mglovesfun (talk) 19:42, 29 June 2011 (UTC)
Failed RFV. Equinox 14:58, 18 December 2011 (UTC)


Only in Serrano's paper, which does not seem to appear on Google Scholar. Equinox 00:20, 1 July 2011 (UTC)

Failed RFV. Equinox 14:55, 18 December 2011 (UTC)


A huge mouthful of a definition with nothing I can find on Google Books or Groups. "(Internet) A designer, developer or administrator that is versed in the building and maintaining of websites, web servers, routers, and web applications. One with the understanding of all things web-related, having a high understanding of the web as a whole. Their functions include, but are not limited to, the following: building pages, writing code, administering servers/routers." Equinox 22:17, 1 July 2011 (UTC)

Failed RFV. Equinox 14:54, 18 December 2011 (UTC)


"(slang|internet|neologism) A podcast interview." Nowt in Google Books and Groups. Equinox 23:21, 1 July 2011 (UTC)

Failed RFV. Equinox 22:26, 25 November 2011 (UTC)

spell model[edit]

"The intricate or complex structure(s) of a spell, especially intricate or complex enchantments, (think like a mathematical or data model.) Often involved in the creation of new spellwork and spells." Equinox 20:41, 7 July 2011 (UTC)

Failed RFV. Equinox 15:32, 11 October 2011 (UTC)


Needs citations meeting the company name CFI. -- Liliana 11:58, 18 July 2011 (UTC)

Delete. It’s for Wikipedia. — TAKASUGI Shinji (talk) 00:41, 1 December 2011 (UTC)

Deleted. — TAKASUGI Shinji (talk) 02:42, 4 January 2012 (UTC)


Was marked with {{attention}}. Needs whatever a fictional character needs for citation. Has no cites now. DCDuring TALK 04:25, 2 August 2011 (UTC)

Changed to rfv-sense, I added the surname definition. Also, is there no English word cartman? We don't have it. Mglovesfun (talk) 08:51, 2 August 2011 (UTC)
Do now. 09:31, 2 August 2011 (UTC)
RFV-failed. - -sche (discuss) 05:40, 12 October 2011 (UTC)


Alt spelling of koumiss. Evidence of this in English, please. All I can find is one Google Books result where it is italicised as a foreign word. Equinox 20:57, 7 August 2011 (UTC)

Failed RFV. Equinox 14:51, 18 December 2011 (UTC)

父時間 / 父天空 / 父土地 / 母自然 / 母地球 / 母土地[edit]

None of these are valid by my ken. All created by IP user Special:Contributions/

All contain links to JA WP, which this user loves to add to entries even when there is no such JA WP article -- as is the case for all six of these entries.

If no one can verify these, could we put them on the list for speedy deletion? -- Eiríkr Útlendi | Tala við mig 20:56, 8 August 2011 (UTC)

I can't seem to find any google reference that uses any of these words in the way they are defined on wt. I have informed the author about this thread. Maybe we should wait to see what he/she can come up with? JamesjiaoTC 21:49, 8 August 2011 (UTC)
Thank you for the cool head, James.  :) By way of background, I have tried numerous times to contact this user, as have others, as noted on User_talk: and also over at Wiktionary:Requests_for_cleanup# and Wiktionary:Requests_for_cleanup# I feel a sense of frustrated anxiety, as this user, while apparently acting in good faith, seems very much the bull in the china shop. When I start seeing pidgin Japanese (as the above) echoed across the intarwebs by the various WT mirrors, some purporting a certain amount of authoritativeness, my sense of urgency increases.
That said, that's my problem, and waiting a (short?) while for the user to pipe up is likely the best course of action. -- Cheers, Eiríkr Útlendi | Tala við mig 22:07, 8 August 2011 (UTC)
That's the kid that creates entries from Anime and Manga, isn't it? JamesjiaoTC 22:28, 8 August 2011 (UTC)
I think so, one of the same IP users for Wiktionary:Requests_for_verification#霊漿 / 霊法 above. -- Eiríkr Útlendi | Tala við mig 22:47, 8 August 2011 (UTC)
The very same, and the same user who created 良気 which I added to this page too. I believe it is the same user at User_talk: who was blocked at that IP for a longer period, and Special:Contributions/, which the user seems only to have access to occasionally. I generally avoid messing with entries related to magic or religion, but when they concern the real world I check them and usually find it necessary to edit or undo them. Haplology 04:57, 9 August 2011 (UTC)
I think the time to assume good faith has passed. Anything that gets zero relevant hits on Google Books/News/Scholar/Groups and also very few relevant Google hits in Japanese should get deleted. There is a danger of us having a few dozen made up words simultaneously. And the edit in question hasn't replied here, two days later. --Mglovesfun (talk) 10:06, 10 August 2011 (UTC)

No further comments added, and in agreement with Mglovesfun, I'm adding these to RFD. -- Eiríkr Útlendi | Tala við mig 14:37, 22 August 2011 (UTC)

PS - Since I've added these to RFD, should I strike them out here? -- Eiríkr Útlendi | Tala við mig 14:46, 22 August 2011 (UTC)


Another, again by Special:Contributions/ I was tempted to put this on RFD, but it does appear that this term is used on the Japanese web -- at least, Google is returning what look like valid hits. From the context I see in the hits, I suspect this term is an alternate spelling for まじない or のろい. The content given on the 祝呪い page is in need of massive overhaul at any rate, since the user just copied the content from 祝呪 in the mistaken belief that these are the same words.

Can anyone verify what this word is supposed to mean? Even just a confirmed reading would be useful -- used しゅうじゅい by extension from the しゅうじゅ on the 祝呪 page, but that reading is also wrong (it should be しゅくじゅ). -- Cheers, Eiríkr Útlendi | Tala við mig 17:10, 10 August 2011 (UTC)

  • Delete. I have googled it and found nothing. I have found 祝呪い解除 for example, but it means "congratulations, cancellation of curse." It must be at most a fictional term in a game or a manga. — TAKASUGI Shinji (talk) 13:08, 2 December 2011 (UTC)

Deleted. — TAKASUGI Shinji (talk) 00:44, 9 December 2011 (UTC)


Eirikr tagged with rfd, I changed it to rfv and moved it here. Does this term get enough hits to avoid speedy deletion? --Mglovesfun (talk) 15:43, 11 August 2011 (UTC)

Googling to exclude Wikimedia sites and mirrors shows 42 hits here. Adding "の" to search specifically for Japanese entries gets nine hits here, but all of them are actually Chinese sites showing Chinese usage, where someone just happened to use Japanese elsewhere on the page.
I'm not that up on Chinese, and still a bit fuzzy on WT's criteria for inclusion, so I have no clear idea whether these 42 hits constitute enough to keep this entry (reworking it to be a Chinese term instead of Japanese, of course). -- Cheers, Eiríkr Útlendi | Tala við mig 15:51, 11 August 2011 (UTC)
Should I delete my post from WT:RFD#截氣神功, then? -- Eiríkr Útlendi | Tala við mig 16:10, 11 August 2011 (UTC)
Probably should remove it, yes, I can see why a user might think that Requests for deletion is the place to request any form of deletion. Anyway, what I actually meant was in practical terms, anything that's very unlikely to pass - no Google Book, Scholar, Group or News hits - is susceptible to get speedily deleted. It's not a 'policy' it's just that this page is so massive, that we need to spend our time trying to cite the borderline cases, ones which may be citable, but also which may not be citable. Mglovesfun (talk) 21:55, 11 August 2011 (UTC)
Someone's obssessed with the w:Airbender. This is used only in the universe of this Japanese manga series along with firebending, waterbending and earthbending. Should be deleted as it obviously fails CFI. JamesjiaoTC 23:55, 15 August 2011 (UTC)
All the Chinese links in Google hits are related to 降世神通, or the Avatar. JamesjiaoTC 00:46, 25 August 2011 (UTC)
It's been over a month and no one has presented any compelling evidence of validity. Searching for google books:"截氣神功" still gets zero hits. Is anyone opposed to deleting the JA entry? James and any other sinophone editors, what is your take on the Mandarin entry? -- Eiríkr ÚtlendiTala við mig 06:36, 26 October 2011 (UTC)

google books:"截氣神功", google scholar:"截氣神功", google groups:"截氣神功" -- triple bupkus for Japanese and Chinese both. Failed RFV.

Yes check.svg Done, striking. -- Eiríkr ÚtlendiTala við mig 00:10, 15 November 2011 (UTC)


Doesn't seem attestable on Google Books. ---> Tooironic 04:19, 12 August 2011 (UTC)

And IINM all Google Groups results are mentions. RFV failed.​—msh210 (talk) 20:38, 27 October 2011 (UTC)


Really? SemperBlotto 21:16, 12 August 2011 (UTC)

Cleaned up and added citations. ---> Tooironic 12:14, 13 August 2011 (UTC)


"Having two or more of one's own senses absent (i.e. being blind, deaf and/or mute), either by having been born so or having lost them due to sickness or an accident." Equinox 22:03, 12 August 2011 (UTC)

Not in the OED, American Heritage, MacMillan, Collins, any of the 4 Webster's at OneLook (1828, 1913, 4th ed., 11th ed) or Random House Unabridged. Move to rfd and get rid of it. -- · 16:04, 13 August 2011 (UTC)
We don't need an RFD if it's unattested, that's what this page is for! --Mglovesfun (talk) 20:09, 13 August 2011 (UTC)
Right you are, Mglovesfun. Lost my head for a minute there. I expect we'll soon be rid of it, in any case. · 14:48, 14 August 2011 (UTC)

RFV failed. Sense removed from entry. · 21:08, 23 October 2011 (UTC)


"(botany) A seed capsule in the form of a box, the seeds being released when the top splits off." I just can't seem to find evidence for this in usage. Equinox 22:39, 13 August 2011 (UTC)

Three examples among others from gbooks :
  • Henderson's dictionary of biology: "pyxidium n. a capsular fruit which dehisces transversely, the top coming off as a lid"
  • Flowering plants, Dicotyledons: "The large, globose, woody pyxidium of Bertholletia is secondarily indehiscent and has only a small operculum that falls inwards. This species drops the pyxidium to the ground and is dispersed by agoutis."
  • Fabre Poet of Science: "The capsule of gold−beater's skin, in which the grubs of the Cione are enclosed, divides itself, at the moment of liberation, into two hemispheres "of a regularity so perfect that they recall exactly the bursting of the pyxidium when the seed is distributed" (note: Cione = Cionus thapsus).
Or did I misunderstand your request? — Xavier, 23:54, 15 September 2011 (UTC)
I have added three additional citations to the entry. Is there any further objection to striking this as verified? bd2412 T 02:21, 25 September 2011 (UTC)
No objection from me; I say it passes RFV. - -sche (discuss) 02:26, 25 September 2011 (UTC)
Calling it struck, then. bd2412 T 02:31, 25 September 2011 (UTC)

Foghorn Leghorn[edit]

"(trademark) A fictional, large, anthropomorphic rooster who is a character of Looney Tunes and Merrie Melodies." Needs to meet WT:BRAND. Equinox 19:52, 18 August 2011 (UTC)

This and Fluffy (and the others) also need to meet WT:FICTION, right? - -sche (discuss) 20:41, 18 August 2011 (UTC)
In what sense are these "physical products"? Fugyoo 10:41, 20 August 2011 (UTC)
Fugyoo is right here, these need to meet WT:FICTION but WT:BRAND doesn't apply. I'd be quite happy just to rfd all of these. Mglovesfun (talk) 11:19, 20 August 2011 (UTC)
I'll have to get right on entering the names of all companies in the world that do not provide physical products, their product line being limited to services. Then there are all of their service names and the service names used by companies that also have physical products. We are sadly very deficient in our coverage of these, apparently due to a longstanding misreading of WT:BRAND.
Almost any fictional character could have a service mark. As I am not an intellectual property attorney or expert, I am not sure whether obtaining license revenues from the sale of merchandise associated with the character requires that there also be a trademark. DCDuring TALK 11:39, 20 August 2011 (UTC)
Regarding whether or not WT:BRAND applies: note this previous discussion. Regarding trademark requirements, we could ask User:BD2412. - -sche (discuss) 22:04, 20 August 2011 (UTC)
RFV-failed. - -sche (discuss) 06:08, 12 October 2011 (UTC)


"A fictional giant three-headed dog in the Harry Potter franchise." Equinox 19:53, 18 August 2011 (UTC)

Should go to the Appendix for the Harry Potter universe. JamesjiaoTC 22:09, 18 August 2011 (UTC)
Shouldn't even go there. Are all giant three-headed dogs in that realm called "fluffies"? It seems to me that it is merely the name of one character, and if anywhere belongs in an appendix of common pet names. bd2412 T 18:50, 25 September 2011 (UTC)
I have taken the liberty of moving it to the HP appendix, which is where these specific characters are "meant" to go anyway (though I still fail to see the value of movie cast lists in a dictionary). Equinox 18:57, 25 September 2011 (UTC)

Porky Pig[edit]

"(trademark) A fictional anthropomorphic pig who is a character of Looney Tunes and Merrie Melodies." Needs to meet WT:BRAND. Entry also suggests (without any evidence at this point) that it "may" be used attributively to indicate speaking with a stutter. Similarly I suppose Yul Brynner "may" be used in jokes about baldness. Equinox 19:57, 18 August 2011 (UTC)

RFV-failed. - -sche (discuss) 06:11, 12 October 2011 (UTC)


"A fictional anthropomorphic cat who is a character of Looney Tunes and Merrie Melodies, whose full name is Sylvester J. Pussycat, Sr., and who usually stars the role of antagonist of Tweety." This would be a fine Wikipedia article. Needs to meet WT:BRAND, being a trademark. Equinox 19:58, 18 August 2011 (UTC)

Sufferin' succotash! Mglovesfun (talk) 21:54, 18 August 2011 (UTC)
RFV-failed. - -sche (discuss) 06:12, 12 October 2011 (UTC)

罠カード / 魔法カード[edit]

Another pair by suspect IP user Special:Contributions/ Apparently only used in the Yu-Gi-Oh universe, which would seem to fail WT:CFI. Can anyone confirm use in other contexts? -- Eiríkr Útlendi | Tala við mig 20:08, 22 August 2011 (UTC)

RFV Failed. Yes check.svg Done, striking. -- Eiríkr ÚtlendiTala við mig 23:51, 14 November 2011 (UTC)


Entry added by known-suspect IP user Special:Contributions/ Specific to the Naruto anime/manga franchise, and therefore would seem to fail WT:CFI. Can anyone confirm any use in other contexts? Moreover, the entry contains no information. -- Eiríkr Útlendi | Tala við mig 20:41, 22 August 2011 (UTC)

No, it’s just Naruto, the anime character. —Stephen (Talk) 21:10, 22 August 2011 (UTC)
RFV Failed. Yes check.svg Done, striking. -- Eiríkr ÚtlendiTala við mig 23:50, 14 November 2011 (UTC)


Previous discussion: Talk:broom.

Tagged but not listed. Rfv-sense: a verb meaning "(slang) To travel by car or another fast vehicle." - -sche (discuss) 22:33, 24 August 2011 (UTC)

RFV-failed. - -sche (discuss) 04:46, 12 October 2011 (UTC)


Tagged but not listed. Rfv-sense: an adjective meaning "exalted". - -sche (discuss) 01:34, 25 August 2011 (UTC)

RFV-failed. - -sche (discuss) 04:46, 12 October 2011 (UTC)


Rfv-sense: Clifford the Big Red Dog. All the citations include the word "dog", and don't meet WT:BRAND WT:FICTION (or WT:BRAND, either).--Makaokalani 13:12, 25 August 2011 (UTC)

Sense removed (by anonip, but correctly). RFV failed.​—msh210 (talk) 02:25, 10 November 2011 (UTC)


Another from our favorite Japanophile IP user, Special:Contributions/ As noted at ja:w:狼男, the more common words are 狼人間 (ōkami ningen) or 人狼 (jinrō) - can anyone verify 狼人 (rōjin)? -- Eiríkr Útlendi | Tala við mig 04:33, 29 August 2011 (UTC)

I speedily added this as a Japanese translation werewolf but you must be right. 狼人 is indeed incorrect in Japanese. I have removed the translation. Delete the entry. --Anatoli 04:52, 29 August 2011 (UTC)
RFV-failed. - -sche (discuss) 06:48, 29 September 2011 (UTC)


Rfv-sense: Is that really an English word? --The Evil IP address 19:44, 15 September 2011 (UTC)

Cited, I think. Also, I corrected the definition. - -sche (discuss) 20:58, 15 September 2011 (UTC)
Passed. - -sche (discuss) 22:54, 24 January 2012 (UTC)


"alert, verbal, pain, unresponsive" I would have thought would be AVPU. AVAP appears to have legit uses, just... not as "alert, verbal, pain, unresponsive". — [Ric Laurent] — 22:42, 15 September 2011 (UTC)

Also if you're alert and verbal then how can you also be unresponsive? What does this term actually mean?! Equinox 22:45, 15 September 2011 (UTC)
LOL. Maybe you tell the EMT (verbally) you admire the high thread count of his shirt (you're alert and attentive), but you refuse to say how or where you're injured (you're in pain, but unresponsive)? - -sche (discuss) 23:34, 15 September 2011 (UTC)
No usable content given? Creative or inventive protologism? --Mglovesfun (talk) 23:31, 15 September 2011 (UTC)
"alert, verbal, pain, unresponsive" Nick Clegg? --Mglovesfun (talk) 23:42, 15 September 2011 (UTC)

So to clarify no one is alert and unresponsive. This is an initialism. It's used to remember how to determine LOC level of consciousness. Alert means to check and see if the patient notices the responder and is able to respond normally, in not, you verbally ask them, if that doesn't work you perform a trapezeus pinch or chest rub (inflict pain on the muscles on the top of their shoulder squeezing it hard or rub your knuckles into their sternum hard) while probing them verbally loudly, but if all that fails they are unresponsive.Gtroy 04:31, 16 September 2011 (UTC)

I have created AVPU (which seems to be real). SemperBlotto 09:39, 16 September 2011 (UTC)
The Wikipedia article for AVPU has two links at the bottom from the same journal by different authors, both of which use the term, so that'd be two citations. Gtroy hasn't addressed the misspelling issue yet. What say you Gtroy? Mglovesfun (talk) 09:46, 16 September 2011 (UTC)
Godfuckingdamnit. I hereby confess I am dislexic. I literally can not see the difference between AVPU and AVAP without eyeing it very carefully. This is very frustrating. Thanks for putting it in the right place guys.Gtroy 10:36, 16 September 2011 (UTC)


RFV of the adjective section, especially the "made of the wood of an oak" sense. I think "oak table" uses the noun "oak" attributively, and I cannot find examples of adjectival use, like "became oak" or "too oak" or "more oak than". The colour sense is more plausible. - -sche (discuss) 02:43, 16 September 2011 (UTC)

Ruakh commented in the Beer Parlour that "Oak really shades into adjectiveness. It's used both attributively and predicatively in ways that resemble an adjective (google books:"oak furniture", "the furniture was oak")." I think this is a way most mass nouns which are materials can be used, a result of their being mass nouns and not as asign of their shading into adjectivity: compare "clay bricks", "the bricks are clay"; "titanium hull", "the hull is titanium". - -sche (discuss) 05:39, 17 September 2011 (UTC)
Yes, I think most mass nouns denoting materials shade into adjectivity to varying degrees. Don't get me wrong, sometimes they're pretty clearly still nouns (it would be hard to contend that "carved oak" is an adjective in "furniture was carved oak"), but they resemble adjectives in their primary uses (both attributive and predicative), they are often coordinated with adjectives (see google books:"was oak and very", "were oak and very"), and when they do transition into full adjectives it's so smooth that no one notices until someone asks, "hey, how come we say 'more fun' instead of 'funner'?" and the answer turns out to be that fun was originally only a mass noun denoting the (abstract) material of which certain activities consist. (For some speakers it still is.) —RuakhTALK 14:47, 17 September 2011 (UTC)
Thumbs up or thumbs down for the adjective sense? I'd say delete. --Hekaheka 03:09, 25 September 2011 (UTC)

Delete sense. On a side note, while paging through the L.L. Bean catalog I noticed many shirts and sheets and so forth available in colors including "oatmeal", "sand dune", and "bay leaf". I think that the use of somewhat evocative nouns to indicate colors in those circumstances are a matter of marketing, not meaning. bd2412 T 18:47, 25 September 2011 (UTC)

Sense deleted, striking. --Hekaheka 22:38, 24 January 2012 (UTC)

Jalpi Turkic[edit]

No hits for the phrase in Google book search. Do we accept international auxiliary languages? SemperBlotto 17:21, 18 September 2011 (UTC)

We accept words in some international auxiliary languages, like Ido. We also accept that the name of any language is a word used in other languages, if that is demonstrable. In this case, that hasn't been demonstrated. - -sche (discuss) 02:00, 19 September 2011 (UTC)
Could perhaps be speedily deleted, gets just 54 Google Hits, some of which aren't in English, some of which are Wiktionary and its mirrors. Google Books, News, and Scholar all get zero hits, Google Groups gets two hits... in Turkish! Neither of which are usenet. Mglovesfun (talk) 08:18, 19 September 2011 (UTC)

Gone. Mglovesfun (talk) 08:32, 21 September 2011 (UTC)


Not listed in any dictionaries to hand. Google only shows 11 non-Wikimedia hits for the phrase anywhere on the web (google:"賢術の"+-wiki+-wiktionary), suggesting that this is a rare term indeed. Given the dubious nature of many of the entries added by Special:Contributions/, I'm adding this to RFV. -- Eiríkr Útlendi | Tala við mig 07:02, 19 September 2011 (UTC)


Not listed in any dictionaries to hand. Google only shows 10 non-Wikimedia hits for the phrase anywhere on the web (google:"巫法の"+-wiki+-wiktionary), suggesting that this is a rare term indeed. Most (all?) of those hits seem to be the same sites as for 賢術 above. Given the dubious nature of many of the entries added by Special:Contributions/, I'm adding this to RFV. -- Eiríkr Útlendi | Tala við mig 07:08, 19 September 2011 (UTC)

I'd be happy to speedy-delete this one and the one above. Mglovesfun (talk) 08:14, 19 September 2011 (UTC)
Ta then, please do. If and when folks can show actual use on more than a handful of dubious sites, I'd be happy to have these terms, but as it currently stands, these two really look like so much noise. -- Eiríkr Útlendi | Tala við mig 15:57, 19 September 2011 (UTC)


For WTF meaning "Why The Face". The one quotation there already is (A) not serious and (B) a mention, not a usage. Fugyoo 11:17, 21 September 2011 (UTC)

I also tagged "Wikileaks Tasks Force", because I suspect that this sense doesn't meet the "spanning at least a year" criterion. -- Liliana 11:52, 21 September 2011 (UTC)
delete this is a one time mention on a tv show and its the only time i have ever heard it.Gtroy 18:17, 23 September 2011 (UTC)

deleted both -- Liliana 22:59, 30 November 2011 (UTC)


250 raw Google hits. Nothing on Google Books or Usenet. Could be speedily deleted. - -sche (discuss) 18:24, 29 September 2011 (UTC)

It was speedy deleted yesterday, but was recreated by the contributor. Mglovesfun (talk) 18:25, 29 September 2011 (UTC)


Rfv-sense - interjection. SemperBlotto 20:43, 2 October 2011 (UTC)

Does sounds that unlikely to me, but searching Google Books, Scholar, News and Groups for "freshman freshman freshman" gets nothing relevant at all. Mglovesfun (talk) 11:59, 5 October 2011 (UTC)

RFV failed; deleted.​—msh210 (talk) 23:11, 20 November 2011 (UTC)

black sanlus[edit]

I don't see this spelling on Google Books. - -sche (discuss) 07:53, 3 October 2011 (UTC)

  • More rubbish from Gtroy sockpuppet - I would delete it. SemperBlotto 08:04, 3 October 2011 (UTC)
    • I deleted it, as I saw nothing on Books and Groups (or Google itself!). - -sche (discuss) 08:17, 3 October 2011 (UTC)
Speedily deleted by someone. Equinox 14:02, 7 October 2011 (UTC)

sex lines[edit]

"The visible indentations made by the ilium marking the threshold between the navel and the thighs on fit people." Very plausible, but "her sex lines", "his sex lines" aren't on Google Books. "Sex lines + abs" (a word commonly used with "cum gutters") also found nothing. References to telephone sex lines are plenty. - -sche (discuss) 08:00, 3 October 2011 (UTC)

  • More rubbish from Gtroy sockpuppet - I would delete it. SemperBlotto 08:05, 3 October 2011 (UTC)

RFV failed. Deleted.​—msh210 (talk) 23:13, 20 November 2011 (UTC)


This plural is AFAICT not attested, except on 16 incomprehensible, not-durably-archived websites. - -sche (discuss) 08:04, 3 October 2011 (UTC)

More rubbish from Gtroy sockpuppet - I would delete it. SemperBlotto 08:06, 3 October 2011 (UTC)
I've deleted it. - -sche (discuss) 08:17, 3 October 2011 (UTC)
Salpingopharyngei is what you're looking for. — Raifʻhār Doremítzwr ~ (U · T · C) ~ 08:30, 3 October 2011 (UTC)
And that plural form is attested! Fantastic, that solves this issue. - -sche (discuss) 08:43, 3 October 2011 (UTC)
Speedily deleted by someone. Equinox 14:03, 7 October 2011 (UTC)

weitaming M[edit]

Mandarin? Cantonese? Citations? -- Liliana 17:48, 5 October 2011 (UTC)

Please see wéitāmìng M. 08:06, 6 October 2011 (UTC)
Delete. Now. Mglovesfun (talk) 21:32, 5 October 2011 (UTC)
Deleted, it's abc123's work, (today - Engirst, when he uses his account, that is). --Anatoli 21:46, 5 October 2011 (UTC)
I don't think this word actually exists - there are four hits on Google Books of dubious nature. ---> Tooironic 10:07, 6 October 2011 (UTC)
I've deleted the toned pinyin per my user page comment. Mglovesfun (talk) 14:56, 6 October 2011 (UTC)
Speedily deleted by someone. Equinox 14:02, 7 October 2011 (UTC)


Rfv-sense: "A prostitute living in a port town." - -sche (discuss) 07:00, 6 October 2011 (UTC)

I question -sche's motivations for this nomination...looks to me liked he just saw the word "prostitute" and flipped. That's not right; that's censorship. Nonetheless, I added a website and book that use "coaster" in that context Purplebackpack89 (Notes Taken) (Locker) 02:39, 9 October 2011 (UTC)
Nobody is censoring anything. This is a debate where people can provide input. I'm curious about this word, too, 'cause I've never heard it. About your two references: #1 actually says "a 'coaster' prostitute", which might suggest that coaster just means "someone living or working near the coast"; #2 looks more promising, but coaster is still marked with a footnote, suggesting that English readers won't know what it is (or it isn't a typical translation, or not a usual English word). Abraham Saul Burack's Writing detective and mystery fiction (1945) actually mentions it in reference to #2, also in quotation marks: "To revert to The Shanghai Bund Murders: Captain North's first problem was to discover who had murdered a young Englishman who was in love with Ruby Braunfeld, a notorious "coaster" known to be in touch with the bandit generals." Equinox 02:46, 9 October 2011 (UTC)
I think the reason it's in a footnote is because the book is written in American English, but the term is from Chinese English, which is a variant of British English. Part of the problem is that the term hasn't really been used since the 1930s, and is especially used to refer to a lady of the evening from Shanghai. Being in quotes just means it's a slang or a euphamism; I would argue it doesn't discount it as a definition altogether. Purplebackpack89 (Notes Taken) (Locker) 03:20, 9 October 2011 (UTC)
It doesn't disqualify it, but we need to find three citations from three different sources. The only other one I can find (I tried searching for e.g. Shanghai + coaster + sex) is also referring the same film: 1993, Gina Marchetti, Romance and the "yellow peril" page 59: "In Shanghai Express ... Lily has become a "coaster," a vamp who travels along the China coast looking for men to victimize". So was this word only used in one film? If not, can you show us anywhere else it was used? Equinox 03:26, 9 October 2011 (UTC)
Two...don't forget Van Wyck Mason. That means I need only one more, and I've got, what, four and a half days to find it? And how comes -sche isn't participating in this discussion...he nommed it, and then left, leaving me to do all the work. May I suggest searching "China" instead of "sex". Oh, and to weed out references to roller coaster, exclude "roller coaster"? Purplebackpack89 (Notes Taken) (Locker) 03:54, 9 October 2011 (UTC)

RFV failed; deleted.​—msh210 (talk) 23:17, 20 November 2011 (UTC)

.NET Framework[edit]

needs citations meeting WT:BRAND criteria -- Liliana 20:11, 6 October 2011 (UTC)

Citing WT:CFI: 'A brand name for a physical product should be included if it has entered the lexicon'. The term does not refer to a physical product. I am not saying we need to keep ".NET Framework", but that has nothing to do with WT:BRAND. --Dan Polansky 07:27, 7 October 2011 (UTC)
This user has added a lot of software products and software trademarks. I'm not really even sure that we should have .NET (which I added a while ago, but not with great enthusiasm and only to disambiguate from the existing .net). Equinox 09:32, 7 October 2011 (UTC)
I seem to think it is a physical product rather than a concept. It's not tangible in the way a wooden table is, but nor is heat or electricity or sound or vibrations, but I would nevertheless consider all four of those physical. Mglovesfun (talk) 09:35, 7 October 2011 (UTC)
Heat, electricity and sound are not physical products, unlike cars. Software is also not a physical product. A physical product is space-extended, can be touched, and has a mass. Physical products include cars, computers, consumer electronics, footwear, clothing, and food. What is not physical product includes bank accounts, insurance contracts, software, databases (data collections), movies, books, and songs. Citations missing, though. --Dan Polansky 11:55, 10 October 2011 (UTC)

RFV failed; deleted.​—msh210 (talk) 23:19, 20 November 2011 (UTC)


"(derogatory, slang) the paternalistic and controlling way that Apple treats customers of its consumer products, and the lack of personal control or freedom on those devices; instead having a centralized and uniform experience across any such device" Equinox 12:22, 7 October 2011 (UTC)

  • Nothing obvious in the first few pages of Google book "hits", but quite a few hits in blogs and the like. Maybe a protologism. Several other similar entries by the same editor are also a bit iffy. SemperBlotto 14:56, 7 October 2011 (UTC)
  • No ggc either.​—msh210 (talk) 23:22, 20 November 2011 (UTC)

RFV failed; deleted.​—msh210 (talk) 23:22, 20 November 2011 (UTC)


The usage examples provided do not use the word. SemperBlotto 07:09, 8 October 2011 (UTC)

Is it worth citing when all uses will be referring to the Urantia Book? Do things only mentioned in dubious non-mainstream religious books count as "fictional universes"? Another Urantia word is ultimaton (supposed sub-electron particle). Equinox 09:50, 8 October 2011 (UTC)
Three citations of which two aren't referring to the book itself would be nice. That is something like 'Urantia Book calls it a finaliter' shouldn't be accepted, but 'usage' independent of it to refer to the same concept should. Mglovesfun (talk) 18:00, 10 October 2011 (UTC)

RFV failed; deleted.​—msh210 (talk) 23:26, 20 November 2011 (UTC)


Appears unattestable: google books:"Hyde公园". A speedy delete as unattestable is an option, IMHO. --Dan Polansky 15:26, 8 October 2011 (UTC)

Article has been deleted Purplebackpack89 (Notes Taken) (Locker) 02:46, 9 October 2011 (UTC)
There did seem to be one Google Book hit. It could also be sum of parts. Mglovesfun (talk) 22:21, 9 October 2011 (UTC)


Rfv-sense: Gender-neutral pronoun. Tagged but not listed. -- Liliana 20:14, 15 October 2011 (UTC)

w:Spivak pronouns says that Spivak pronouns 'are not in widespread use' but the Wikipedia article does give three books that employ such pronouns. So I suppose this and the related pronouns could pass. Mglovesfun (talk) 09:36, 17 October 2011 (UTC)
The second one isn't independent tho. -- Liliana 16:46, 17 October 2011 (UTC)
Cited. - -sche (discuss) 20:01, 17 October 2011 (UTC)

RFV passed. Thanks, citer.​—msh210 (talk) 18:04, 23 October 2011 (UTC)


RFV for two English senses and one French sense:

English senses[edit]

These two are not as the word is defined in the NED ("The front part of the head or skull."):

the forehead[edit]

It is possible to interpret the NED’s 1767 quotation as supporting this sense. — Raifʻhār Doremítzwr ~ (U · T · C) ~ 12:31, 19 October 2011 (UTC)

RFV failed. — Raifʻhār Doremítzwr ~ (U · T · C) ~ 04:04, 27 January 2012 (UTC)

the whole upper half of the human head[edit]

It is possible to interpret the NED’s ante 1848, 1873, and figurative circa 1638 quotations as supporting this sense. — Raifʻhār Doremítzwr ~ (U · T · C) ~ 12:31, 19 October 2011 (UTC)

RFV failed. — Raifʻhār Doremítzwr ~ (U · T · C) ~ 04:04, 27 January 2012 (UTC)

French sense (forehead)[edit]

Presumably, the French sinciput would be best translated using the English sinciput, rather than forehead. — Raifʻhār Doremítzwr ~ (U · T · C) ~ 12:31, 19 October 2011 (UTC)

RFV failed. Retranslated with “sinciput”, with front (forehead) included in a See also section. — Raifʻhār Doremítzwr ~ (U · T · C) ~ 04:04, 27 January 2012 (UTC)


Likely bogus, added by an IP user whose behavior looks awfully similar to our other fantasy-and-Japan-obsessed-but-non-Japanese-speaking IP contributors.

This term is not in any dictionary I have to hand, nor Jim Breen's (http://www.csse.monash.edu.au/~jwb/cgi-bin/wwwjdic.cgi?1C, you'll have to paste in the term) or even Eijiro (http://eow.alc.co.jp/雷気). Google Books throws up tons of hits (google books:雷気), but the first page of 100 that I pored over all look like scannos for 電気 instead. google:"雷気"+の+-wiki brings in a lot, but many hits have punctuation between the two characters, and others show use in bigger compounds, but there is some use as a nickname, and this page shows its use as the title of a piece of music.

The meaning is understandable from the spelling; my concern is that it shows up in none of the expected places if this were a regular and fully attestable word. Does anyone else know if this term is sufficiently cromulent? -- Eiríkr ÚtlendiTala við mig

Haplology took care of this on 15 November. Yes check.svg Done, striking. -- Eiríkr ÚtlendiTala við mig 17:53, 29 November 2011 (UTC)


Added by known-problematic IP user Special:Contributions/ The IP user in question added this term at about the same time as they added ドールハウス (dōruhausu), making me think that they were just trying to add translations of English terms, without regard for (or knowledge of?) SOP considerations.

The entry as it stands is misspelled and mistransliterated. The proper headword would be 人形の家, and the transliteration would be ningyō no ie instead of the given ningyō uchi. However, under the proper headword, this becomes a purely SOP entry, comprised of 人形 (ningyō, doll) + (no, possessive marker) + (ie, house), which parses as no different from [anything] + の + 家. The only possibly idiomatic use of this phrase that I can find is the translation of the title of the play The Dollhouse by Norwegian playwright Henrik Ibsen, but I don't think that's sufficient for inclusion here on WT. Please chime in if I'm wrong in this.

Google Books shows few hits (google books:allintext:+"人形家"+は), mostly with punctuation between, or use in compounds where the ending 家 character belongs to the next word. I find only one hit showing use as a full term apparently meaning dollhouse, but there's almost no context given and I don't have access to the full text. There are two hits I see in the list that show use as a full term, but apparently meaning someone who makes dolls as a profession, and at that it looks like these are a specific kind of doll used in traditional Japanese decorative displays, as shown here.

Can anyone else cite this term used to mean dollhouse? Shall we rewrite the entry to mean someone who makes dolls as a profession, and look for the one additional citation needed to meet WT:CFI? -- Eiríkr ÚtlendiTala við mig 17:38, 21 October 2011 (UTC)

I've found the same results, just a handful for the shops selling hina matsuri dolls, such as here [7] at the bottom. I'd say rewrite the entry for the meaning doll-maker. Haplology 14:34, 28 October 2011 (UTC)
Haplology took care of this on 15 November. Yes check.svg Done, striking. -- Eiríkr ÚtlendiTala við mig 17:51, 29 November 2011 (UTC)


The example sentence is wrong, for one. I cannot find any cites for this verb, either. -- Liliana 21:48, 21 October 2011 (UTC)

No, the example sentence is right. It's this verb that's wrong. It should be zu Abend essen. —Angr 22:38, 21 October 2011 (UTC)
Hmm, is that even an idiomatic expression? One could argue zu Abend warrants an entry, but zu Abend essen looks very much like SoP to me. -- Liliana 22:40, 21 October 2011 (UTC)
I found one cite: "Haben Sie Zeit, mit mir abendzuessen?" I'll look for more later. - -sche (discuss) 22:41, 21 October 2011 (UTC)
On de.wiktionary it is tagged with {{Austria}}, a possible indicator? -- Liliana 22:49, 21 October 2011 (UTC)
Yeah, that's my experience — that it's southern dialectal. The cite I mention above is from a Viennese author. - -sche (discuss) 00:44, 22 October 2011 (UTC)
+1 more Viennese author and +w:Martin Walser, this is cited, and tagged as "southern Germany and Austria". - -sche (discuss) 01:03, 22 October 2011 (UTC)
Cool! Then I'm closing this as rfv-passed -- Liliana 19:02, 25 October 2011 (UTC)


Rfv-sense -

I'm not finding anything for this word indicating a meaning of invisibility, only lots of material about a particular aspect of Buddhist thought, which is already given as the first def. This invisibility sense was initially added by IP user Special:Contributions/ when they created the page; I thought it was bogus, and dictionary and web searches led me to replace that with the current Buddhist def. IP user Special:Contributions/ just re-added the invisibility sense, but with no cites or anything to back it up. I'm putting this here at RFV now in the hopes that someone more versed in Japanese fantasy works might be aware of this sense. -- Eiríkr ÚtlendiTala við mig 05:43, 22 October 2011 (UTC)

Nothing forthcoming and I've found nothing either in the meantime, so I'm removing the sense.
Yes check.svg Done, striking. -- Eiríkr ÚtlendiTala við mig 17:50, 29 November 2011 (UTC)


Any takers? (Nothing obvious on the first few pages of Google hits). SemperBlotto 07:12, 23 October 2011 (UTC)

Seems legit, if obsolete:
  • 1892, Henry M. Gougar, "Christ and the Liquor Seller", The Arena: Volume 7, p. 467:
    In Kansas no man dares to flaunt his sign in the eyes of the public, to entice custom; the liquor seller is the sneaking boot-legger, skulking jointist, criminal and outlaw, afraid of every shadow that falls across his hiding-place...
  • 1901, Massachusetts Reformatory, Our Paper: Volume 17, p. 237:
    While we were waiting for the train one day, a prominent Topeka jointist was talking with her. Presently he went out on the platform, I where some one heard him say, "There were a lot more things I wanted to say, but I should have broken down and made a fool of myself if I had stayed there any longer." Later I heard this man talking with another jointist on the train, and he was insisting that Mrs. Nation was a good, kindly old woman. The very jointkeepers recognize that she is their friend, and she speaks truly when she says that every blow of her hatchet is prompted by love.
(The article is about prohibitionist Carrie Nation).
  • 1901, Charles Moreau Harger, "Kansas's Prohibition Status", The Independent, Volume 53, p. 431.
    The injunction method has proved the most successful, action being brought against the jointist and the building he occupies as against a common nuisance. This is tried before the judge, and not a jury. Once made permanent, the injunction is not likely to be violated for fear of contempt. It is weak in that it does not punish the jointist and does not prevent his changing location and starting in business again.
  • 1906, "The Character of the Enemy We Are Fighting", Gleanings in Bee Culture: Volume 34, p. 1380:
    I have avoided jury trials, because, if the jointist is acquitted by a jury, the county must pay the costs. By using the injunction, a vastly different result is obtained. When a jointist can not disprove a charge, the court will fine him. The liquor-men do not fight this kind of case—they go into court and allow the injunction to be made permanent.
  • 1911, "The Governor of Oklahoma and Prohibition", The Advance: Volume 62, p. 271:
    It seems that it is very easy for the local officials in your county to arrest a man acting under a commission issued by the special enforcement officer of the state, but the gambler, the bootlegger and the jointist is each permitted to ply his trade, wreck homes, destroy youth, and make a laughing stock of the laws of this state with impunity.
Cheers! bd2412 T 03:09, 24 October 2011 (UTC)
Are there any objections to deeming this verified on the basis of the citations provided, and striking this dicussion? bd2412 T 16:07, 26 October 2011 (UTC)
Looks OK to me. BTW Google's NGram viewer facilitates the acquisition of dated usage information for a term (not a sense). In this case, the term was not used before about 1885 and stopped appearing in newspapers around the end of w:Prohibition in the US, though it still seems to have appeared in legal textbooks (and cases?). DCDuring TALK 17:23, 26 October 2011 (UTC)
Yeah, this is RFV-passed. - -sche (discuss) 18:47, 26 October 2011 (UTC)


More apparently bogus content from our magic-obsessed Japanophile IP user, Special:Contributions/

Not in any dictionary to hand. google books:"気術" shows only use where the 気 actually belongs to the preceding word. -- Eiríkr ÚtlendiTala við mig 05:23, 24 October 2011 (UTC)

Not in any of mine either. Fishy as all get out. Delete Haplology 14:12, 28 October 2011 (UTC)
Striking so we can tell it's done by looking at the TOC. -- Eiríkr ÚtlendiTala við mig 19:39, 14 November 2011 (UTC)


'Middle Earth'? It seems more like Old English, but is that verifiable? —CodeCat 23:44, 14 October 2011 (UTC)

There's an Old English translation of the Hobbit?? Where?? Mglovesfun (talk) 10:19, 15 October 2011 (UTC)
Fictional word - I can't quite read the ang.wikipedia article. SemperBlotto 10:30, 15 October 2011 (UTC)
Basically "The Hobbit is a book by J.R.R. Tolkien", it doesn't say that such a creature would be called a 'holbytla'. As a matter of interest, if the word is attested in Old English but only in the context of a fictional universe, does it meet CFI or not? Mglovesfun (talk) 10:34, 15 October 2011 (UTC)
This may well sum if up, "Tolkien says that he translates this kûd-dûkan term into the invented word holbytla from which hobbit might just have been derived if holbytla had ever existed in the ancient language (hol-bytla is a made-up Old English compound meaning "hole-dweller")". (The Origins of Tolkien's Middle-earth For Dummies). Mglovesfun (talk) 12:14, 15 October 2011 (UTC)
Something coined in modern times can't be Old English, can it? Has this word been used or only mentioned? Equinox 13:06, 15 October 2011 (UTC)
No, it's never been used. JRRT came up with it as a pseudo-etymology of ‘hobbit’. It's not real. Ƿidsiþ 13:08, 15 October 2011 (UTC)
@Equinox that's a bit controversial as we allow Modern Latin even though Latin is a dead language. It's hypothetically possible to write in Old English and coin new words. Mglovesfun (talk) 15:06, 15 October 2011 (UTC)
This touches upon the serious issue of attestation for words used only in certain fictional universes. What is the rule of thumb? I dimly recall reading someone else saying that usage in at least three fictional universes was required (or was that just "preferred"?). This issue is important for me to better understand in order to handle all the Japanese magic- and fantasy-related terms that have cropped up. -- Eiríkr ÚtlendiTala við mig 22:42, 17 October 2011 (UTC)
If this is a translation of "hobbit" into Old English, then it's no longer fictional, since "hobbit" is used as a nickname for H. floresiensis . Or does that not count? (though the entry at hobbit is suspiciously missing this widely used usage of "hobbit") 09:47, 20 October 2011 (UTC)
That'd not count, as this is a translation of the other sense of hobbit into ang.​—msh210 (talk) 18:06, 23 October 2011 (UTC)

(Re: Latin, dead language doesn't mean unused language.)

More info conveniently assembled here. *holbytla is not Old English, it's Tolkien's speculative OE-like reconstruction, created for flavour in his fiction and not as part of any academic linguistics work. If we find three independent citations in modern English, then it is English for our purposes. I don't imagine it's likely to be attested in Old English, since that language is not much used to write durably-archived sources these days. Michael Z. 2011-12-15 19:13 z

squibble [edit]

Sounds like a valid entry, but I cannot verify it. If it is used, where is it used? I surely have never heard of it. JamesjiaoTC 20:31, 3 November 2011 (UTC)

It's in UrbanDictionary and basically nowhere else. A search for "a squibble of" finds very little. I think we should probably speedily delete it. Equinox 21:29, 3 November 2011 (UTC)
Deleted as a protologism. SemperBlotto 07:59, 4 November 2011 (UTC)
The word form "squibble" seems attested, with whatever meanings: google books:"squibble". Some occurrences: [8], [9], [10], [11], [12]. --Dan Polansky 19:43, 7 November 2011 (UTC)

star magic, sun magic, moon magic[edit]

Not content with only adding bogus JA entries, IP user Special:Contributions/ has begun adding bogus EN entries as well. Unless I'm mistaken, all three of these are little more than SOP and should be deleted, but on the off chance that I'm wrong, I'm adding here to RFV. -- Eiríkr ÚtlendiTala við mig 20:37, 5 November 2011 (UTC)

Add some heart magic and clover magic, and your magical breakfast will be complete! ☺ ~ Robin 20:52, 5 November 2011 (UTC)
Don't forget the diamonds too.  :-P -- Eiríkr ÚtlendiTala við mig 21:04, 5 November 2011 (UTC)
FWIW, I've given this IP user a one-day break in the hopes of forestalling their copious avalanche of rubbish. Going through their contribs, it's the exception that I find anything that doesn't need fixing or flat-out deleting. -- Eiríkr ÚtlendiTala við mig 21:07, 5 November 2011 (UTC)
Using the style like "(a/the) star(s)" is really annoying, as well as " (or around,)". Mglovesfun (talk) 18:33, 6 November 2011 (UTC)
Yes, this user and Special:Contributions/ are both known for lack of knowledge about WT formatting conventions. Or WT:CFI. Or Japanese, despite adding so many entries and page content for this language. Every once in a while they add something that doesn't need fixing/reformatting/deleting, but I'd hazard that's only around 20% of the time, if that. -- Eiríkr ÚtlendiTala við mig 20:29, 6 November 2011 (UTC)
Yes, not to defend him/her, their work is still horrible overall and they are slow to learn, but I've noticed that they are getting better gradually, from absolutely awful to fairly awful. They should be given a break though. Haplology
Remember that RFV is the forum where we try to demonstrate that something exists; problems like "encyclopedic" and "sum of parts" are RFD's domain. --Mglovesfun (talk) 14:35, 7 November 2011 (UTC)
Doh, thank you MG, moving forthwith.  :) -- Eiríkr ÚtlendiTala við mig 18:23, 7 November 2011 (UTC)

Discussion moved to WT:RFD#star magic, sun magic, moon magic. -- Eiríkr ÚtlendiTala við mig 21:32, 7 November 2011 (UTC)

Yes check.svg Done, striking. -- Eiríkr ÚtlendiTala við mig 18:48, 30 November 2011 (UTC)

dick snot[edit]

I'm not sure if this is a real word, without three cites this could as well be a protologism or neologism, or a sopLucifer 22:54, 13 November 2011 (UTC)

Lmao, it already has two cites. I'm striking this and adding a third. Dork :P — [Ric Laurent] — 23:42, 13 November 2011 (UTC)
Can't really be SoP because snot specifically means stuff that comes from a nose. Equinox 23:48, 13 November 2011 (UTC)


"blowbuddy" gets one apparently valid books.google result, "blowbuddies" gets more, but a significant number of them are for some website. "blow buddies" gets some results, but I'm not going to sort through and add cites that point to the legitimacy of the given definition. — [Ric Laurent] — 01:47, 14 November 2011 (UTC)

Alright, Troy added some. — [Ric Laurent] — 02:09, 14 November 2011 (UTC)

Yay, alls well that ends well.Lucifer 05:05, 16 November 2011 (UTC)


Word from Naruto. No results from Google Books: [[13]] and 2 results from G Scholar--in Chinese. [[14]] Haplology 14:20, 14 November 2011 (UTC)

Yes check.svg Done, striking. -- Eiríkr ÚtlendiTala við mig 19:16, 5 December 2011 (UTC)

barba partida[edit]

My Spanish is pretty rudimentary - but I would have thought a cleft chin was barbilla partida. SemperBlotto 22:35, 14 November 2011 (UTC)

I think they're synonyms. I know there are other ways to say it, too. Troy added three citations. — [Ric Laurent] — 22:59, 14 November 2011 (UTC)
Spanish Wikipedia says they are synonymous: barbilla partida. --Hekaheka 06:43, 15 November 2011 (UTC)
Also my RAE says: barba 1. Parte de la cara, que está debajo de la boca. | 2. Pelo que nace en esta parte de la cara y en los carrillos … --Hekaheka 06:49, 15 November 2011 (UTC)
OK. I have fixed the Wikipedia link to point to the Spanish entry (which is a redirect) and added the barbilla version. SemperBlotto 08:23, 15 November 2011 (UTC)
Thanks guys, y ahora sé lo que quere decir carrillo!Lucifer 05:04, 16 November 2011 (UTC)

Fred Flintstone[edit]

Fictional character. Needs to meet WT:FICTION and possibly (since it's a trademark used for various products and media) WT:BRAND. Equinox 18:39, 15 November 2011 (UTC)

And Wiktionary:Votes/pl-2010-12/Names of individuals. Mglovesfun (talk) 12:09, 26 January 2012 (UTC)


Is this spelling correct in Romanian? Chișinău must be the correct one. --Anatoli 22:17, 15 November 2011 (UTC)

Moreover, is it correct in Estonian? That language doesn't have an Ş last time I checked. -- Liliana 22:19, 15 November 2011 (UTC)
I actually found the answer to my first question: Comma-below (ș and ț) versus cedilla (ş and ţ). In the Romanian wiki Chişinău is simply a redirect to Chișinău, not an alternative spelling. --Anatoli 22:21, 15 November 2011 (UTC)
(EDITED) IMHO, because of the issue with missing characters in previous versions of Windows, we should make Romanian entries with cedilla below (ş and ţ) redirects to entries with comma (ș and ț), the latter is standard), thus enabling users not able to type the more standard characters or finding non-standard spelling. As for the Estonian, they are just following the original Romanian spelling. The currect Estonian wiki is Chișinău (as in standard Romanian). So it should move Chișinău, in my opinion.--Anatoli 22:29, 15 November 2011 (UTC)
From what I see that is already common practice among Romanian editors, so there should not be any issues with it. -- Liliana 22:31, 15 November 2011 (UTC)
BTW, the Romanian wiki has declension, anyone skilled in templates, please create declension template, if you can. I also created Кишинэу - the Cyrillic version (Moldovan). --Anatoli 22:38, 15 November 2011 (UTC)
Back in February and March, we voted to use comma-below for Romanian, with cedilla spellings being redirects where possible; see [[Wiktionary:Votes/pl-2011-02/Romanian orthographic norms]]. So far as I know, the result of that vote is still in effect. —RuakhTALK 03:52, 16 November 2011 (UTC)
Great, thanks for the link! I'll convert the cedilla entries to redirects. --Anatoli 04:22, 16 November 2011 (UTC)

This seems to have been handled adequately, so I'll strike it. — [Ric Laurent] — 12:18, 16 November 2011 (UTC)


Needs at least two more citations. — [Ric Laurent] — 03:50, 16 November 2011 (UTC)

all done.Lucifer 06:39, 16 November 2011 (UTC)
I don't like this one: "He automatically began to hump my mouth sending it into my throat gagging me at times." because it looks like a co-ordinate construction (? is that the right word for it), i.e. "sending it into my throat and gagging me at times". Fugyoo 10:41, 16 November 2011 (UTC)
You're right, so I'm removing that one. Now there's been another sense added with only one quotation, so if another two citations for that one aren't added, and now one more for the first.... — [Ric Laurent] — 12:15, 16 November 2011 (UTC)
I added what I could find, its in common usage, its a synonyms for throat fucking/irrumatio.Lucifer 19:01, 16 November 2011 (UTC)
If what's there now is all you can find, the entry will have to be deleted for lack of verification. I'm pretty sure it can be verified, but the verification will have to actually be done. — [Ric Laurent] — 20:17, 16 November 2011 (UTC)
If anyone can point me at them I'll add them, but all I added was what I could, I was surprised I had trouble finding good ones.Lucifer 10:37, 17 November 2011 (UTC)
The current version has two citations for the first sense, of which the second is not from a published work (and is a mention rather than a use, anyway).​—msh210 (talk) 21:01, 16 November 2011 (UTC)
Damn, I missed that, too. Removing. — [Ric Laurent] — 21:33, 16 November 2011 (UTC)


IP Wizard has created a Holy Things series, some of which is verifiable, one of which was previously deleted, and some of which is dubious. I present this term, which I think is 聖地 plus 地面 and a little magic kanji dust to make a new word, but correct me if I'm wrong and my dictionaries and I are missing something. Haplology 04:13, 16 November 2011 (UTC)

It seems like a rare synonym of 聖地 but you can, of course, break it as + 地面. --Anatoli 05:33, 16 November 2011 (UTC)
Quick checks:
So we get exactly one valid usage, but not in a format that meets WT:CFI. I'd vote for nixing the entry. -- Eiríkr ÚtlendiTala við mig 17:57, 23 November 2011 (UTC)
I just deleted it. No way this is real. JamesjiaoTC 02:24, 28 November 2011 (UTC)

stupid shit[edit]

I think this is a verifiable word, and we have dumb fuck, stupid fuck, chickenshit, they are all the same family of insults and this one is very common.Lucifer 23:12, 17 November 2011 (UTC)

"stupid shit" and stupid fuck (which YOU created) are two-word phrases, dumbfuck and chickenshit are single-word compounds, which we tend to treat differently from two-word phrases like stupid shit and stupid fuck. — [Ric Laurent] — 23:17, 17 November 2011 (UTC)
They are all written both as one word and as two words.Lucifer 23:43, 17 November 2011 (UTC)
You can't just say that, you need to verify it. Dumbfuck yeah, but I've never seen stupidfuck or stupidshit anywhere, ever, except here, because you added them. — [Ric Laurent] — 00:37, 18 November 2011 (UTC)
I didn't, they are both verified, I'm not making it up. Have you ever heard someone call someone a stupid shit? or stupid fuck?Lucifer 03:50, 18 November 2011 (UTC)
... but there are two words in this expression. Why do you insist on using the word "word" for "two-word terms"? Dbfirs 08:09, 18 November 2011 (UTC)
Word is used in a typographic sense, but also in a linguistic sense (same sense as term). If you think that this is a term, then it should be includable (blue bicycle is not a term, not a word, but is it possible to consider stupid shit as a term, as a word in the linguistic sense, I have no idea). Lmaltier 08:18, 18 November 2011 (UTC)
As far as I can tell, all the two word terms added by Troy are simple sums of parts and should be deleted. SemperBlotto 08:22, 18 November 2011 (UTC)
Naturally I agree. — [Ric Laurent] — 01:09, 19 November 2011 (UTC)
.. as do I, with possibly one or two exceptions. I'm evidently not a linguist since I don't consider the words "word" and "term" to be synonyms. Dbfirs 09:28, 19 November 2011 (UTC)
An interesting page: https://courses.washington.edu/info200/win12/word.htm
For typographers, runs and run are different words, and presqu'île, so long or on-line are composed of two words. For linguists, runs and run are the same word (they belong to the same lexeme), and presqu'île, so long or on-line are single words (items of vocabulary). This is what I was meaning. We seem to miss the typographic sense in word. Lmaltier 18:16, 19 November 2011 (UTC)
I suppose "Any sequence of letters or characters considered as a discrete entity" covers a wide range of senses. The OED distinguishes "words" from "compound terms" consisting of two or more words, with or without hyphens. Dbfirs 10:44, 20 November 2011 (UTC)
Very interesting you brought that up, but I think that shows there's a debate and I think most people think a vocabulary term is a word.Lucifer 08:42, 27 November 2011 (UTC)


Not listed in any dictionaries to hand - these all have 月兎, but not 月野兎. Entry created and heavily edited by known-suspect IP users. Online hit counts:

I suspect adequate citations could be found to warrant keeping the JA entry, but I wonder if the main content should be moved to 月兎? Hits for 月兎:

In addition, the Mandarin entry at 月野兎 is just a copy-paste of one sense of the JA entry, which makes me rather suspicious. Could one of our sinophone editors have a look? -- Eiríkr ÚtlendiTala við mig 19:48, 18 November 2011 (UTC)

Ugh. 月野兎 is one Mandarin name of the fictional character w:Tsukino Usagi, whose Japanese name is a homephone for the mythical w:Moon rabbit. Literally it (月野兎) means "moon hare" but that's not what the Moon Rabbit is called in Chinese. This IP doesn't have a clue what it's doing. Delete the whole thing. Fugyoo 22:17, 18 November 2011 (UTC)
I got there before you. Shot on sight by me. Complete, utter, unverifiable bull. JamesjiaoTC 01:55, 28 November 2011 (UTC)


Entry added by known-suspect IP user. Not finding any other dictionaries that list this term with the meanings listed. Just from the kanji, this means (sen, one thousand) + (hon, counter for long slender things), and has nothing explicitly to do with acupuncture. The linked JA and EN WP articles don't exist. The included picture is also included on the w:Acupuncture page, but the IP user edited the caption from there to replace "acupuncture" with this apparently spurious word "senbon".

Hit counts, searching for "千本" (this term) + 鍼 ("needle", more specifically referring to acupuncture needles and thus likely to occur in this context) + の (the Japanese possessive particle, pretty much guaranteed to appear just on Japanese pages and thus a good way to weed out Chinese hits):

The 千本 page lists 千本術 as a derived term. Hits:

Has anyone else heard of this? Or shall we just pull the big lever that opens the trap door under the stage, and send this dancing monkey down the garbage chute? -- Eiríkr ÚtlendiTala við mig 23:29, 18 November 2011 (UTC)

I believe 千本 literally translates to a thousand (counter for long thin objects such as needles). I highly doubt it's used to mean a needle for acupuncture (which is most likely written as 鍼と針 or 鍼の針 - needle used for acupuncture). Its usage as a ninja weapon seems to be mainly inspired by w:Naruto. There is simply no evidence I can find that shows it is in fact a traditional throwing weapon used by REAL ninjas. JamesjiaoTC 02:18, 28 November 2011 (UTC)
Great, thank you James for confirming my suspicions. I'll strip the page down to a bare-bones proper lexicographical entry for the meaning of "one thousand long thin objects", ideally at some point later today. -- Eiríkr ÚtlendiTala við mig 18:47, 28 November 2011 (UTC)
Yes check.svg Done, striking. I also tracked down Wikipedia user w:User:Samuraiantiqueworld who added a mention of senbon to the w:Shuriken page in this edit, and asked them if they had a source for any real-world instances of an acupuncture tool or ninja weapon called a senbon. If they (really a "they", as best I can tell, as the user account seems to be shared by employees of SamuraiAntiqueWorld.com) get back to me with any valid sources, I'll edit the page accordingly. -- Eiríkr ÚtlendiTala við mig 17:37, 29 November 2011 (UTC)
Note: Samuraiantiqueworld got back to me. Their post and my reply from User_talk:Eirikr#senbon-shuriken are included below:
    • Hello, I uploaded the image to commons [[15]] and labeled it as a "shuriken", another user removed shuriken and substituted "senbon", I replaced "shuriken" and left "senbon" after doing some research. If you search for "senbon needles" or "senbon shuriken" etc on google image and web search you will find some examples. I have found some references that refer to senbon as "one thousand needles". "Senbon" seems to be used in manja a lot.[[16]][[17]]

Samuraiantiqueworld 01:16, 30 November 2011 (UTC)

    • Thank you for the background information, I appreciate it. As it stands, it looks like senbon might be becoming an English word meaning some sort of (imaginary?) ninja weapon, but 千本 as Japanese doesn't seem to have any such connotations. I'll amend the entry and discussion here on Wiktionary accordingly. -- Kind regards, Eiríkr ÚtlendiTala við mig 01:23, 30 November 2011 (UTC)
FWIW, I can only find manga- and anime-related uses for senbon as an English term. Until such time as this has entered more mainstream (and citable) use, I'm not sure if it yet merits inclusion here. -- Eiríkr ÚtlendiTala við mig 01:31, 30 November 2011 (UTC)
What's wrong with manga- and anime-related uses? As long as we can find three independent uses, in printed sources or Usenet, it merits inclusion. I'm not finding anything on Google Books, so I don't know what you're looking at--any possible uses of senbon as an English word are drowned out by proper noun usages and transliterated Japanese.--Prosfilaes 02:59, 30 November 2011 (UTC)
I had a look at:
As the searches become more restrictive, it becomes clearer that the term senbon as English appears to show up pretty much exclusively in Naruto contexts, which fails the CFI for fictional universe terms of use in at least three fictional universes.
(I should have been more specific previously; it's not that I'm opposed to manga or anime as a genre, though I am quite unfamiliar with this area. My concern is rather that many of these anon IP user terms from manga and anime come from only one fictional universe.) -- Eiríkr ÚtlendiTala við mig 04:38, 30 November 2011 (UTC)
I have googled the term. It seems to be used in the ninja manga カムイ伝 and then adopted by Naruto. The standard word for the weapon is 棒手裏剣, which we already have. — TAKASUGI Shinji (talk) 09:37, 30 November 2011 (UTC)

generative medicine[edit]

Probably added for the sake of a spammy link to a pseudoscientific Web site, which I have removed. Little or no evidence on Google Books (beware of false matches from hyphenated regenerative medicine). Definition is shitty too. Equinox 02:05, 19 November 2011 (UTC)

  • Yes, I have already looked on Google book search. There are a few positive hits, but I couldn't really find anything to support the current (strange) definition. SemperBlotto 08:32, 19 November 2011 (UTC)
  • Definitely not added for the sake of any links, as you'll notice that I didn't contest your removal of my link which was to the .org, not the .com, which is a spam source. The site for Center of Excellence in Generative Medicine at the University of Bridgeport is the .org, not the .com. I guess some clever asshat bought up the .com and is using is a spam source.  :-/ I added the initial appearance in the academic medical textbook Fundamentals of Generative Medicine, first published last year, to the entry. Based on what I read on the CFI page, that would be the best reference. I'm curious to know why you guys say that my definition is "shitty" and/or "strange." I was the first resident in this new medical specialty, I practice generative medicine every day, and I'm trying to help increase awareness as it's just over 18 months old. Anyway, please clarify your concerns, and I'll work on improving it. Let me know if you have any additional questions/concerns, and once again, thanks for your help! Rivanlord 08:26, 20 November 2011 (UTC)
Ah, that spammy site led me down the wrong path, didn't it! This is now cited. I shortened the definition a little because it was very wordy. Thanks. Equinox 19:49, 20 November 2011 (UTC)
RFV passed - Thanks Equinox. Rivanlord 05:58, 1 December 2011 (UTC)


Please verify sense 2, "1/25th of a teaspoon — from the 1975 U.S Bureau of Standards"

  • what is the "U.S Bureau of Standards"? does this mean NBS (now NIST), or ANSI?
  • which 1975 standard? Can't we cite a standard number if this is real?

Maybe this is real, but my gut makes me very suspicious.... 08:55, 19 November 2011 (UTC)

I'd say it's nonsense. Check this [18] as an example. In order to avoid this becoming another unsolved discussion, I deleted the sense and wrote a usage note. --Hekaheka 06:10, 21 November 2011 (UTC)


'ere we go again. Not seeing anything usable here: [19] Equinox 22:37, 19 November 2011 (UTC)

But I cited it with three quotations.Lucifer 22:58, 19 November 2011 (UTC)
These appear to be scannos. Did you look at the physical scanned page? The 1904 one is particularly ridiculous: you think that somebody was sent an obese woman? No, of course it's a scanno for "fat cow": he was sent a large animal for meat. Equinox 23:02, 19 November 2011 (UTC)
Hefers have been pestering men since 1904 and beyond so yes I do.Lucifer 23:54, 19 November 2011 (UTC)
Obvious bullshit. Slang like "cow" for a woman was not casually used in literature of that time. I'm starting to think you're just here to troll. Equinox 02:52, 20 November 2011 (UTC)
Yet more tosh. Rapidly approaching tosh-limit. SemperBlotto 08:08, 20 November 2011 (UTC)
Damn you guys are saints compared to me, I hit my tosh-limit days ago! D: — [Ric Laurent] — 12:07, 22 November 2011 (UTC)
Every single one of those quotations is questionable. The 1904 one is clearly absurd; the second one is possible, though I can't see the page. The last one ... the text doesn't support or disprove the definition--somebody can check the 1972 Treasure Island at 1:00:00 into the movie for that--but given that on the last page we have it spelled "fat cow" and on this page we have "my path" and then "mypath" below it, and "gallows for" and "gallowsfor", I think we have to assume that the loss of a space is a typo, not a spelling choice.--Prosfilaes 07:01, 21 November 2011 (UTC)
It's a very common insult.Lucifer 09:06, 22 November 2011 (UTC)
The common insult is spelled with a space. Equinox 12:23, 22 November 2011 (UTC)
And infrequently it is spelled as one word.Lucifer 09:18, 27 November 2011 (UTC)
... presumably by mistake? Dbfirs 16:54, 12 December 2011 (UTC)
  • Deleted, cites did not stand up. Ƿidsiþ 07:11, 10 January 2012 (UTC)


Highly bogus content: not in any dictionary to hand, etyl given is for avatar, JA WP link is to a disambig page about place and ship names, reading is wrong even if this were a valid word, and most of the synonyms given aren't even proper synonyms. Added by one IP user and edited by another who are both known for lack of Japanese or Chinese skills. Mandarin entry too looks bogus. Hits for Japanese:

Nix the whole thing? Or does someone here know of cromulent uses for this term outside of the Airbender universe? If memory serves, we'd need citations from at least three fictional universes to pass muster. -- Eiríkr ÚtlendiTala við mig 05:29, 20 November 2011 (UTC)

The same discussion we had with the Mandarin counterpart applies here. Enough said. JamesjiaoTC 01:46, 28 November 2011 (UTC)
Oh dear, my memory fails me -- what discussion was there about the Mandarin counterpart? The current Mandarin entry at 降世神通 just gives a def of avatar, but the linked Chinese WP article is clearly about The Last Airbender. Looks like we ditch the whole page for failing CFI, then? -- Eiríkr ÚtlendiTala við mig 18:40, 28 November 2011 (UTC)
LOL. You got me there. I remember there was a conversation somewhere regarding 阿凡达, but I can't seem to find it now. In summary, in that conversation, the author defined the term as avatar, but in reality it only applies to the movie w:Avatar. The same analogy applies here. The Last Airbender is also known as the Avatar (the original name of the Anime series, not the James Cameron bluey thingies) to some and that's probably where the definition came from (by probably I mean 99.9% chance). So my advice is to exterminate the entry. JamesjiaoTC 21:45, 29 November 2011 (UTC)
Oh I just realized that he created the Mandarin section for it as well. The previous paragraph applies to that as well. JamesjiaoTC 21:51, 29 November 2011 (UTC)
  • Delete the whole article: the Japanese section is a bogus, and the Mandarin section is incorrect because it is the name of the TV program. — TAKASUGI Shinji (talk) 00:07, 5 December 2011 (UTC)

Deleted: bogus contents related to the TV program. — TAKASUGI Shinji (talk) 05:44, 10 December 2011 (UTC)


Another from Special:Contributions/ Not in dictionaries to hand, web searches show only scannos, cases with punctuation between the two characters, or use in Chinese contexts. Hits for Japanese:

Keep, and add {{qualifier|manga}} or some such? Or ditch? -- Eiríkr ÚtlendiTala við mig 19:05, 20 November 2011 (UTC)

Speedy delete - Anime/game inspired name/character/title/character class name with no real idiomatic meaning. I've already blocked the user (twice), first time for including tosh entries that the person just invented himself, inspired by anime most likely, second time for dodging the first block with a different IP. JamesjiaoTC 05:01, 27 November 2011 (UTC)
Done. Haplology 07:07, 27 November 2011 (UTC)


Added by Special:Contributions/ Just from the kanji, the word might mean "wind demon". However, it's clear the IP user never read the JA WP article they linked to, which is all about the Fūma ninja clan (c.f. w:Fūma Kotarō) and makes no mention of wind demons. This Fūma clan mention makes sense in the context of the shuriken compound listed, at least.

Blah. I'm spending almost all my time lately tracking down IP user rubbish. -- Eiríkr ÚtlendiTala við mig 19:41, 20 November 2011 (UTC)

That makes me wonder if it's acceptable to block someone for very poor quality entries. The blocking policy is that it should be done to users who (1) "hinder or harm the progress of the English Wiktionary," which I must say very emphatically is what these IP users do, and (2) where "less drastic means of stopping these edits are, by the assessment of the blocking administrator, highly unlikely to succeed", which is also true, as they do not communicate or take advice.
The first one had a quality rate of about 5%--I'm not exaggerating--and the newer one probably is around 40%, and the second one at least may edit in good faith but they both seem to have a serious disregard for checking the accuracy of their contributions. The time it takes to fix one of these spurious entries could have been devoted to multiple high-quality entries, which leads to the conclusion that they are hindering the progress of WT.
They are incompetent in the language they contribute to. They make mistakes with hiragana. Hiragana is not hard. It took me two weeks. I daresay editors of English entries are blocked for much less. Thoughts, anyone? Haplology 13:19, 21 November 2011 (UTC)
If it's ongoing and fixing it is sapping everybody's time then I would block for the "disruptive edits" reason. Equinox 13:25, 21 November 2011 (UTC)
Sounds good. I'll post a note on the Talk pages of the two IP users in question pointing them to this thread and explaining what the current consensus seems to be regarding their activities. If/when we block them, my suggestion is to allow them to edit their IP user Talk pages, to leave some avenue of communication open, and to allow them to create regular log-in accounts -- if they had regular accounts, then at least they would get that orange New Messages banner when someone writes on their Talk pages, no? Or do anon IP users get that too, and they've just been ignoring that? -- Eiríkr ÚtlendiTala við mig 16:12, 21 November 2011 (UTC)
Anons see it.​—msh210 (talk) 19:31, 21 November 2011 (UTC)
Wow, okay. I have much less respect for what these two anons have been doing, then -- a number of us have tried numerous times to get in touch with these folks via their Talk pages, at the bare minimum to explain why we reverted or changed their edits and to point them towards the proper way of doing things (or at least which reference pages to read to learn this). User_talk: has never replied, and User_talk: replied once to ask a question about an etyl, but that's it. I suspect that I and others have been trying to talk with these two users across multiple IPs, generally all starting with 2.xxx and 90.xxx respectively. I had the most success over at User_talk: back in January of this year.
I'll write both of these IP users later today and let them know that they're on track towards substantially longer blocks if they continue with their current MOs. -- Eiríkr ÚtlendiTala við mig 20:15, 21 November 2011 (UTC)
風魔 is simply the nickname used by the clan leader, which yes literally translates to wind demon and is not idiomatic in anyway. It is otherwise an oft-used name for various Game/Anime characters and/or titles. It will not pass CFI. I'd have deleted it on the spot. JamesjiaoTC 04:58, 27 November 2011 (UTC)
Deleted Haplology 15:51, 6 December 2011 (UTC)


Is this word really an adjectival noun/na-adjective (形容動詞)? I can find it as a noun or just as a form of 有る, but not as an adjectival noun in dictionaries, and I can't find any clear support in search results for "有りな", but maybe I'm just not seeing it. TIA Haplology 05:08, 24 November 2011 (UTC)

The only use I'm familiar with is the one I'm finding in my web searches -- where あり is in juxtaposition to なし, meaning something like the English with or having}, and the な is the generic modifying particle used with adjectival nouns in Japanese in lieu of the の used with regular nouns. Hits include メールしない子って脈有りなのか無しなのか, currently hit number 6 at google:"有りな", or 問題有りな友人を招待すべきでしょうか, currently hit number 7. None of these uses seem to match the def currently given at 有りな.
FWIW, I don't think ===Adjectival noun== is correct for this; this construction seems to represent a different grammatical rule, but a good explanation of it escapes me at the moment. I'll have to look into this later and get back to you. -- Eiríkr ÚtlendiTala við mig 02:39, 27 November 2011 (UTC)
  • Delete the whole article. It is the noun 有り, which is generally written in kana (あり). The copula always becomes before whether the noun is adjectival or not. It is also increasingly common to use even if the noun is not adjectival, when it modifies another noun. (That is one of the reasons why I think the classification of 形容動詞 is meaningless.) — TAKASUGI Shinji (talk) 09:57, 30 November 2011 (UTC)

Deleted: we don’t allow an adjectival noun entry with -な, anyway. — TAKASUGI Shinji (talk) 01:47, 5 December 2011 (UTC)

razolution [edit]

Can anybody look for this word in any source, such as Sociology? --Lo Ximiendo 04:49, 25 November 2011 (UTC)

  • There was no usable content. Deleted SemperBlotto 08:10, 25 November 2011 (UTC)


-- Liliana 03:54, 4 December 2011 (UTC)

This is a made-up word, there never was such society. We have earlier deleted Rindfleisch­etikettierungs­überwachungs­aufgaben­übertragungs­gesetz although it is a real decree given by the state of Mecklenburg-Vorpommern. I'd say delete, at least with the current definition, as it is clearly rubbish. If someone wanted to keep it for some weird reason, the definition might be something like this: "Arguably the longest German word, allegedly published by the Guinness' book of records and spread to numerous websites." --Hekaheka 09:56, 4 December 2011 (UTC)
Can we just stick to giving it a month and deleting it if not cited? Mglovesfun (talk) 22:55, 4 December 2011 (UTC)
No problem, I just pointed out that our current definition can not be verified, but it shouldn't be a problem to find citations for another definition, which would probably be deleted anyway. --Hekaheka 03:34, 5 December 2011 (UTC)
I see no cites. Who would want to delete this baby? --Hekaheka 22:50, 24 January 2012 (UTC)

misc 2[edit]


Rfv-sense According to Compact OED 3rd Ed (2008) the verb and noun are "pratice" for US English, with UK English being "practice" for the noun and "practise" for the verb being correct. Therefore in UK English law you practise law but have a legal practice. In the US both senses should be spelt with a "c" —This unsigned comment was added by (talk) at 15:41, 15 July 2011.

The entry already mentions this under usage notes, so I'm not sure what you want us to do. What exactly needs to be verified? --Mglovesfun (talk) 10:03, 16 July 2011 (UTC)
Struck. - -sche (discuss) 05:18, 13 February 2012 (UTC)


Rfv-sense: Abbreviation of deny.

I can't imagine the context and don't know where to look for usage. DCDuring TALK 17:07, 30 July 2011 (UTC)

A pretty pointless entry. D is an abbreviation for many many things. Different offices etc have various conventions. D = deny, decline, delete, divert, duplicate, etc etc. We should D this entry, imho -- ALGRIF talk 12:30, 1 August 2011 (UTC)
Agreed. Can we go ahead and D (= do) this now? Dbfirs 22:25, 13 November 2011 (UTC)
No support or attempt at verification for over six months, so I'm going to D the sense (and I don't mean duplicate). Dbfirs 09:02, 8 February 2012 (UTC)

霊漿 / 霊法[edit]

Not in my Japanese dictionaries to hand. Not in JA WP despite interwiki link. Entry created and edited by suspect IP users. -- Eiríkr Útlendi | Tala við mig 21:20, 1 August 2011 (UTC)

I don't actually doubt the validity of these entries. I have a problem with the anon listing non-synonyms as synonyms. I digress. Anyway, take a look at this: 霊法会 (reihōkai). Essentially, it refers to an spiritualist offshoot of Shinto Buddhism. I am not into religions, so I don't understand most of it. As for 霊漿, here is a passage from a book by 徳冨蘆花, a 19th/20th century Japanese humanist/philosopher - 巖の如く頑なる魂を透して一滴したたり落ちた天の霊漿. I think in this case, it refers to some sort of spiritual liquid that drips from heaven. Note that this anon seems to be dedicated to editing mysticism/spiritualism/magic related terms in Japanese, which are all attestable as far as I am concerned. The entries are, however, a little too detailed for a dictionary. I've tried talking to him/her about that, but his/her English seems to be limited and I also have a feeling that the person is quite young as he/she talked about receiving instructions from her mother all the time. JamesjiaoTC 22:14, 1 August 2011 (UTC)
Thanks James. One of the IPs listed in the history looks like an IP user I've conversed with successfully in the past, who then amended their editing to be more in line with Wiktionary style and formatting norms. If it's the same user, they are very interested in manga, but they apparently don't have access to any dead-tree reference materials and get all of their definitions from manga, anime, and online sources.
This leads me sideways to a separate question about attestable -- would use of a term in manga be sufficient to warrant inclusion in Wiktionary? -- Cheers, Eiríkr Útlendi | Tala við mig 22:28, 1 August 2011 (UTC)
Yes. As long as it's used in more than 3 separate manga/anime universes, which in the two examples we have here, I have no doubt. JamesjiaoTC 23:13, 1 August 2011 (UTC)
O/T question, but is there such a thing as "Shinto Buddhism"? My understanding was that the two remain largely distinct. The 霊法会 article describes the sect as part of 法華宗, itself part of Japanese Buddhism. Then again Japan is known for its syncretism... -- Cheers, Eiríkr Útlendi | Tala við mig 22:45, 1 August 2011 (UTC)
Shinto Buddhism is a synonym of Japanese Buddhism AFAIC unless I am horribly mistaken? Religion has always been a mind-boggling exercise for me as I am more of a logical thinker. JamesjiaoTC 23:13, 1 August 2011 (UTC)
I'm no expert, but what I remember from uni is that the two are separate. Broadly speaking, Shintō covers the living, and Buddhism covers the dead. So you take newborns to the Shintō priest for a blessing, and you bury your dead in a Buddhist cemetery. -- Cheers, Eiríkr Útlendi | Tala við mig 22:10, 2 August 2011 (UTC)
Interesting. I think I should do more research on this in the future. Thanks for that. JamesjiaoTC 22:03, 8 August 2011 (UTC)
There is a JA WP article on w:ja:霊法会, apparently one of Japan's new religions (新宗教). However, a quick read through the top of the JA WP article indicates that this is a proper religion deriving from the Lotus Sutra of Buddhism, and not just the vague spiritualism or magicalism indicated by the 霊法 definition given.
I rather suspect that the contributing editor, the suspect IP user, based their content solely on their limited understanding from anime / manga, and that 霊法 is either:
  1. not a real term at all, or
  2. a term actually used, but only in certain manga / anime.
I am not a manga reader nor much of an anime viewer, so I have insufficient familiarity with such materials to tell if 霊法 is used in enough manga / anime universes to merit inclusion. If no one else can fill in and confirm this term, I suggest it be deleted. -- Eiríkr Útlendi | Tala við mig 06:45, 12 August 2011 (UTC)


Rfv-sense: (Australia) lustful or sexually aroused.

Not in Macquarie's or OneLook references in this sense, except for Urban Dictionary. Could use citations, presumably from fiction or Groups. DCDuring TALK 11:37, 5 August 2011 (UTC)

Widespread long-term use. I've heard it and used it for 40 years. It's well cited under the linked article on toey as a Roman sandal, but the word is used on its own also.--Dmol 23:27, 5 August 2011 (UTC)
I looked on Usenet and Google Books for "feeling toey", "felt toey", "was toey", but couldn't find quotations that were clearly using it to mean "sexually aroused" as opposed to generically "excited, anticipatory". Still, given the cites Dmol points out at toey as a Roman sandal, it seems quite plausible. - -sche (discuss) 01:05, 6 August 2011 (UTC)
It seems plausible to me too, but Macquarie's has 4 senses, according to Talk:toey, not including the one in question. I've seen usage that implies that someone can feel touchy, restive, apprehensive as a result of being sexually frustrated. The cites at , to the extent that they are intelligible to me and durably attested, don't clearly exclude that interpretation. DCDuring TALK 03:09, 6 August 2011 (UTC)
Agreed. - -sche (discuss) 03:41, 6 August 2011 (UTC)
RFV-failed, although I've kept a "sometimes specifically..." suggestion of it in the first sense, per Dmol. - -sche (discuss) 05:14, 4 February 2012 (UTC)


Could benefit from some more words. Like ones from books. — [Ric Laurent] — 12:54, 6 August 2011 (UTC)

Cited as "toad-strangler". Hard to find "toad strangler". DCDuring TALK 16:24, 6 August 2011 (UTC)
Passed. - -sche (discuss) 05:55, 4 February 2012 (UTC)


Rfv-sense: "A variant of draw poker in which players contribute equally to the pot and in which betting may be started only by a player with a pair of jacks or a better hand. In some variations the pot accumulates if no player is able to start." I was in the belief that this variant is called "jacks or better". --Hekaheka 07:41, 10 August 2011 (UTC)

Difficult. Even if what you say is true, and I have no reason to doubt it, it doesn't preclude this usage. Perhaps more likely is that "jackpot" is any game that involves an accumulating prize pool. One such is described here. Such a sense would possibly be deemed derivative to the prize pool sense. It seems to me that it would be difficult if not impossible to provide three citations that prove the rules of the game. The existing citation, for example, merely hints that they are playing for money. — Pingkudimmi 09:34, 10 August 2011 (UTC)
My understanding is also that there are several variants of poker, which may by played under "jackpot" rule, i.e. there's an accumulating pot involved. In case of "jacks or better", only the variant in which the pot accumulates could be called "jackpot". I think the definition for "jackpot" poker should be something like this: "Any variant of poker in which the pot accumulates until one of the players gets a hand which qualifies for collecting the pot" (which would bring it so close to def #2 that they could be merged). --Hekaheka 16:24, 10 August 2011 (UTC)
This definition was added by User:Pingku. Maybe he knows better. --Hekaheka 16:30, 10 August 2011 (UTC)
Ah.. A mistake, by the look of it; I think I was looking for a definition to match the usage. Thanks for picking this up. Maybe "jackpots"; it's apparently from here, but not backed up with other mentions/usages, as far as I can tell at the moment. — Pingkudimmi 02:59, 11 August 2011 (UTC)
I read a number of poker rules available in the internet. Seems that the original definition is almost correct in the sense that "jacks or better" is usually played with jackpot rule. However, there are many other ways to accumulate a jackpot. I think we should delete the sense on the grounds that "jackpot" or "jackpot poker" may mean any of a number of game variants, and cannot therefore be a set term. --Hekaheka 16:59, 12 August 2011 (UTC)
I've removed the sense but kept a usage note. The usage note could alternatively be converted back into a broad sense encompassing all variants. - -sche (discuss) 00:28, 8 February 2012 (UTC)


Tagged by creator, Ivan Štambuk, in 2008, about a month after he created it. Serbo-Croatian neuter noun, also by extension the Cyrillic spelling listed in the entry. Mglovesfun (talk) 21:43, 10 August 2011 (UTC)

It looks valid; the first Google Books hit is "Viši oblik obitelji je višeženstvo (poligamija) i višemuštvo (poliandrija)." - -sche (discuss) 05:03, 26 October 2011 (UTC)
I've added one citation to the Latin spelling and one to the Cyrillic spelling (вишемуштво), which should both count towards verification of the word, unless someone thinks use of the word is restricted to one script. - -sche (discuss) 05:18, 26 October 2011 (UTC)
RFV-failed with only two citations. - -sche (discuss) 06:00, 4 February 2012 (UTC)


Maro 20:14, 11 August 2011 (UTC)

In general, if an entry was written by Tbot (as this one was) and you're pretty sure it's wrong, you can {{delete}} or delete it without bringing it to RFV. Also please fix the entry it's based on. (The template added by Tbot at the end of the entry indicates which that is.)​—msh210 (talk) 20:13, 14 August 2011 (UTC)
RFV-failed. - -sche (discuss) 06:03, 4 February 2012 (UTC)


Rfv-sense. Serbo-Croatian noun. Tagged by Ivan Štambuk. Mglovesfun (talk) 21:00, 11 August 2011 (UTC)

RFV-failed. - -sche (discuss) 06:07, 4 February 2012 (UTC)


Rfv-sense. Serbo-Croatian noun. Tagged by Ivan Štambuk. Mglovesfun (talk) 21:00, 11 August 2011 (UTC)

RFV-failed. - -sche (discuss) 06:07, 4 February 2012 (UTC)

Charlie Brown[edit]

"(trademark) One of the main characters of the Peanuts cartoon strips by Charles Schulz." Needs to meet WT:BRAND. Equinox 22:45, 13 August 2011 (UTC)

RFV-failed. - -sche (discuss) 06:14, 4 February 2012 (UTC)


Murder. Equinox 00:27, 14 August 2011 (UTC)

I will be surprised if I can't also find a few uses of a verb re+drum; I'm about to go look... - -sche (discuss) 00:23, 15 August 2011 (UTC)
I found "re+drum", I didn't find "murder". I tried phrases like "commit redrum", "is redrum". - -sche (discuss) 07:27, 15 August 2011 (UTC)
RFV-failed. - -sche (discuss) 06:19, 4 February 2012 (UTC)


Rfv-sense "free software". If we ignore this challenged sense, then freeware is "Complete and functional software that does not require payment or other compensation (and) may be a proprietary license with no access to the source code", while free software is either 1. "Software that can be freely copied, redistributed and modified, including source code; software that is libre" or 2. "Any software that is free of charge, such as freeware." The challenged sense is evidently saying that freeware can be sense 1 of free software (i.e. open and modifiable); I dispute this (even if freeware can coincidentally also be open and modifiable, that's not what it means); please cite. Equinox 19:29, 14 August 2011 (UTC)

Fully agreed. A frequent confusion at most. See top warning on w:Free software: "Not to be confused with freeware or open-source software". Free software adepts have been struggling for a long time to make the difference clear to everyone. — Xavier, 00:26, 16 September 2011 (UTC)
RFV-failed. - -sche (discuss) 06:10, 4 February 2012 (UTC)

Hello Kitty[edit]

Trademark; fictional cat used to market cutesy products. Needs to meet WT:BRAND. Equinox 13:06, 16 August 2011 (UTC)

RFV-failed. - -sche (discuss) 06:14, 4 February 2012 (UTC)


Trademark; specific character from the Pokémon range of children's toys. Needs to meet WT:BRAND. Equinox 13:08, 16 August 2011 (UTC)

RFV-failed. - -sche (discuss) 06:14, 4 February 2012 (UTC)

Clark Kent[edit]

Trademark; secret alter-ego of Superman. Needs to meet WT:BRAND. Equinox 13:11, 16 August 2011 (UTC)

  • Would citations for "Clark Kent glasses/spectacles" help? Fugyoo 22:03, 18 August 2011 (UTC)
Not for this entry, bc the title is Clark Kent and not Clark Kent glasses or Clark Kent spectacles. Equinox 22:05, 18 August 2011 (UTC)
  • How about this one?: "The journalists who work alongside Roger White know him for his design skills in creating the newspaper's front page, but underneath that Clark Kent exterior is a man of steel." [20] Fugyoo 09:26, 22 August 2011 (UTC)
Failed RFV. Equinox 01:05, 7 February 2012 (UTC)


Trademark; fictional dog from specific TV series. Needs to meet WT:BRAND. Equinox 13:13, 16 August 2011 (UTC)

RFV-failed. - -sche (discuss) 06:14, 4 February 2012 (UTC)

occlumency / legilimency[edit]

I don't see these terms used outside HP universe. Any takers? JamesjiaoTC 22:33, 18 August 2011 (UTC)

Legilimency already has an open RFV started by me (higher up on this page). Equinox 22:41, 18 August 2011 (UTC)
Those do seem to belong in Appendix:Harry Potter, rather than our main namespace. ~ Robin 13:42, 1 February 2012 (UTC)
RFV failed. Equinox 01:10, 7 February 2012 (UTC)


Previous discussion: Talk:ysterbos.

In Afrikaans the plural of Ysterbos will be Ysterbosse and Ysterbossie will be the diminutive. So I have strong doubts whether that is right. Online searches are proving to be useless, because many sites just copied what wiktionary had on it, so when I get a chance to check some books, I'll do that. CeNobiteElf 15:41, 20 August 2011 (UTC)

The searches should be in Google Books, Google News, or any open-access Afrikaans corpus. I had a lot of trouble finding attestation for the singular, so your prior knowledge of Afrikaans inflection might be both the best we can do and good enough to justify the change. If you are not confident, we can wait for others. DCDuring TALK 15:57, 20 August 2011 (UTC)
Actually, isn't it simple? The word is presumed to inherit the inflection of Afrikaans bos (which does not have an Afrikaans section). DCDuring TALK 16:07, 20 August 2011 (UTC)
I found one use of "ysterbossie" in an Afrikaans book, but Afrikaans verbs lack distinct singular and plural forms, so it is inconclusive. FF Odental's Kernwoordeboek has bos s.nw. (bosse; bossie), and also dag s.nw. (dae; daggie), corresponding to our dag (plural dae, diminutive daggie), so that's a reference supporting "bossie" as a diminutive and "bosse" as the plural. - -sche (discuss) 21:55, 20 August 2011 (UTC)
Indeed, the plural for bos and anything ending on bos will be (-)bosse and for diminutive (-)bossie thanks to regular rules. So unless we can find citations confirming that ysterbossie is the attested English plural form, shall we assume that the English plural is the same as the Afrikaans one? CeNobiteElf 22:43, 20 August 2011 (UTC)
We should consider ysterbossie an {{alternative form of|ysterbos}} rather than the {{plural of|ysterbos}}, because neither of the two citations of it shows it to be plural, and the grammar of Afrikaans also argues it is not the plural form. However, I can't find any durably-archived uses of ysterbosse in any language. There are also no Google Books or Usenet hits for "ysterboses" or "ysterboss", other possible plural forms that English grammar would predict, and there is only one distinct raw Google hit for "ysterboss", which also uses "ysterbossies", but there are also no Books or Usenet hits for "ysterbossies" or "ysterbosies". Therefore, I wouldn't say the English plural of "ysterbos" is "ysterbosse", I would say no plural is attested ({{en-noun|!}}). - -sche (discuss) 23:41, 20 August 2011 (UTC)
I haven't noticed such fastidiousness in the treatment of most non-English languages. Generally folks seem to simply assume that a term inflects as it would if it were a regular member of the class that it appears to be in. This one has a stronger case that most as it is an apparently normal compound of a common word. DCDuring TALK 00:36, 21 August 2011 (UTC)
Oh, to be clear, I would list ysterbosse as the plural of the Afrikaans word in the ==Afrikaans== section, I'm only saying I wouldn't list it as the plural of the English word in the ==English== section. We can only just barely say the singular (of the English word) exists, with only four citations total of the two forms of it; we have no citations or references (pertaining to the English word) to guide us in determining if it inflects, and if so, whether it inflects in an English style (eg ysterbosses, ysterbosss) or an Afrikaans-style (eg ysterbosse, ysterbossies). The Afrikaans word, I agree, we should assume inflects normally. - -sche (discuss) 01:06, 21 August 2011 (UTC)
Resolved. - -sche (discuss) 05:24, 13 February 2012 (UTC)

bitch fight[edit]

Rfv the Polish section. Hard to believe this is actually used in Polish. No hits on books or groups, for that matter. -- Liliana 10:11, 22 August 2011 (UTC)

RFV-failed. - -sche (discuss) 00:32, 8 February 2012 (UTC)


"joy or pleasure that comes from imagining future success". I can find mentions but not uses. Equinox 21:33, 23 August 2011 (UTC)

Here, here. JamesjiaoTC 21:45, 23 August 2011 (UTC)
I don't think that second one should count because it's clearly been created to re-use a word that's been defined elsewhere in the same book. Fugyoo 20:47, 2 September 2011 (UTC)

RFV failed, entry deleted. —RuakhTALK 18:19, 31 January 2012 (UTC)


Rfv-sense: A fictional male pink ball-like character who stars various video games by Nintendo.--Makaokalani 13:14, 25 August 2011 (UTC)

Failed RFV. Equinox 01:03, 7 February 2012 (UTC)


Again by, not in any dictionaries, superficially resembles a verifiable word 外祖母 (maternal grandmother.) This has just under 3000 google hits but most of them are not one continuous string of characters, and of the rest, I doubt that the 内 is actually connected to 祖母, since ...の内 is a common pattern and can be used before a noun. Haplology 17:23, 25 August 2011 (UTC)

Yeah, I saw that too this morning, but I think I found enough googits to suggest use as an actual word... for one, while 外祖母 means maternal grandmother in Japanese and Chinese, 祖母 only means paternal grandmother in Chinese, and in Japanese, it just means either grandmother, so I think this 内祖母 shows up in those rare cases where someone needs to make the distinction. Googling for google:外祖母+内祖母+の (adding the の to make sure we get at least mostly Japanese hits), for example, brings up some more salient use cases. (And, incidentally, some use cases for Chinese as well; google:外祖母+内祖母+也 brings up even more Chinese examples.) It looks broadly verifiable to me, but I haven't gone so far as to dig up citations that meet WT:CFI requirements.
Incidentally, can anyone confirm an etymology? I suspect the (inner / outer) distinction comes from historical marriage patterns in Chinese and Japanese societies (and actually many other societies too), where women would marry into their husbands' families, so that the woman's parents would be "outside" the family in that they'd have different surnames. But maybe I'm reading too much into this, or making the wrong associations? -- Eiríkr Útlendi | Tala við mig 20:45, 25 August 2011 (UTC)
Passed RFV. Haplology 14:40, 15 November 2011 (UTC)
Seeing this again, I'm moved to ask if we have the readings correctly? My instinct is that 内祖母 should be uchisobo instead of naisobo, and that 外祖母 should be sotosobo instead of gaisobo. Takasugi-san, or any other native J editors, what is your sense? -- Eiríkr ÚtlendiTala við mig 17:43, 15 November 2011 (UTC)
The readings naisobo and gaisobo are correct. I will mark them as rare words. — TAKASUGI Shinji (talk) 00:41, 1 December 2011 (UTC)

RFV withdrawn by requester, apparently; striking. I've added {{rfquote}}, though. —RuakhTALK 18:31, 31 January 2012 (UTC)


Tagged but not listed. Anyone here actually speak some Min Nan? Mglovesfun (talk) 23:09, 28 August 2011 (UTC)

User:A-cai does. - -sche (discuss) 23:22, 28 August 2011 (UTC)
...but User:A-cai is the one who tagged it. The usage example, "梏頭鞋", gets no Google Books hits. - -sche (discuss) 21:00, 5 September 2011 (UTC)
RFV-failed. - -sche (discuss) 06:47, 29 September 2011 (UTC)

RFV failed, Min Nan section removed. —RuakhTALK 18:33, 31 January 2012 (UTC)


The entry says it's an English noun meaning "the houseleek", but checking Google Books for "semper-virens" houseleek, I only find species names ... and as far as I can tell, "semper-virens" isn't in the species name of the houseleeks (which are sempervivum). Note that I just cleaned and cited the Latin word sempervirens. - -sche (discuss) 01:11, 30 August 2011 (UTC)

RFV-failed. - -sche (discuss) 22:36, 29 January 2012 (UTC)


Absolutely zero Google Book hits, one Usenet hit that I can see which is this, and in my opinion, that doesn't convey much meaning. I'd tend to accept it if someone can find two others, mind you. Mglovesfun (talk) 09:02, 30 August 2011 (UTC)

RFV-failed. - -sche (discuss) 06:21, 4 February 2012 (UTC)


Trademark; specific character from the Pokémon range of children's toys. Needs to meet WT:BRAND. Equinox 20:09, 26 September 2011 (UTC)

RFV-failed. - -sche (discuss) 07:08, 4 February 2012 (UTC)


Is this ever used?? This, that and the other (talk) 08:05, 27 September 2011 (UTC)

Yes. Cited. Equinox 11:37, 27 September 2011 (UTC)


Rfv; "to pratty", "after pratty", "football pratty" and "soccer pratty" all get no hits on Usenet. "Pratty" gets hits as a spelling of "pretty" (in many of the senses of that word) and as an adjective I would guess is related to "prattle". - -sche (discuss) 17:58, 29 September 2011 (UTC)

RFV-failed. - -sche (discuss) 07:10, 4 February 2012 (UTC)


Rfv-sense: noun meaning "a cannabis smoker". Plausible, but the first several pages of Usenet hits about "potters + smoking" are about makers of pots (ceramic wares). I suspect it belongs in a separate etymology section, if attested. ("Pot", slang for "cannabis" + Fugenelement/reduplicated "t" + "-er".) - -sche (discuss) 20:23, 1 October 2011 (UTC)

RFV-failed. - -sche (discuss) 07:13, 4 February 2012 (UTC)


Rfv-sense: Japanese for Pressure Point. Am I the only one who doesn't understand the definition at all? -- Liliana 20:33, 18 October 2011 (UTC)

I think this is about w:Qigong theory, the meridian lines conveying qi through the body have many specific w:acupuncture points along them where the flow of qi is easier to influence. If memory serves, these points are sometimes called "vessels" in the literature, and tsubo is the Japanese word for both a basin or vessel (a container, not a boat), and for these acupuncture points.
One of my Japanese dictionaries states that the term tsubo as a standard measure of area arose because an encircled area with the base slightly lower than the surrounding portion looks a bit like a basin. I'll update the JA entries shortly to add appropriate definitions.
As for the English entry tsubo#English, the current def is more of an etyl; I'll fix that too. -- Eiríkr ÚtlendiTala við mig 20:49, 18 October 2011 (UTC)
I hope the edits I just made clarify the issue? -- Eiríkr ÚtlendiTala við mig 21:43, 18 October 2011 (UTC)
The tsubo I know is a kind of pressure point used in massage in Japan. If you go to masseurs or masseuses they will apply pressure to those points when giving you a massage, and when pressure is applied to those points it is thought to have health benefits, the particular benefit depending on the point. You can buy goods like foot mats with raised areas that put pressure on the tsubo in your feet when you stand on them, and the points are labelled with the organs that they correspond to. Searching for hiragana つぼ in JA WP gives a disambiguation page, and the main page about these tsubo is here: [[21]]. They are usually just called tsubo and written as hiragana つぼ or katakana ツボ. Haplology 06:17, 19 October 2011 (UTC)
I just added a usage note to the page to clarify that the kana spellings are more often used in acupuncture and acupressure contexts. I think that covers the last concern for this listing, so I'm calling it Yes check.svg Done, and striking. Unstrike if needed. -- Eiríkr ÚtlendiTala við mig 18:55, 30 November 2011 (UTC)


Rfv-sense: "One who holds that society should not punish others, and should leave punishment and retribution to the cosmos or God." - -sche (discuss) 22:55, 24 October 2011 (UTC)

RFV-failed. - -sche (discuss) 20:20, 7 February 2012 (UTC)


Previous discussion: Talk:jokes.

Rfv-sense: the adjective sense, "really good". Questioned in 2004, tagged and listed in 2007, but never cited or removed. - -sche (discuss) 03:52, 26 October 2011 (UTC)

2 cites from durably archived sources. Much more usage at non-usenet Google Groups. DCDuring TALK 15:12, 26 October 2011 (UTC)
Cited, barely! Equinox 22:39, 15 December 2011 (UTC)
Good job finding that last cite! Passed. - -sche (discuss) 19:34, 7 February 2012 (UTC)

fucking with one[edit]

If OK, it should be at fuck with one, but is probably sum of parts. SemperBlotto 08:49, 28 October 2011 (UTC)

Speedily deleted, see fuck#Verb. Mglovesfun (talk) 09:21, 28 October 2011 (UTC)
Actually fuck with. Mglovesfun (talk) 09:35, 29 October 2011 (UTC)


"(slang) Taken out, knocked out, beaten up" -- contraction of "freaking aced". Equinox 12:15, 31 October 2011 (UTC)

RFV-failed. - -sche (discuss) 21:08, 5 February 2012 (UTC)


A dictionary-only word? Google Books finds no actual uses. Equinox 23:04, 2 November 2011 (UTC)

Deleted. - -sche (discuss) 21:12, 5 February 2012 (UTC)


Calculator alphabet. Is mentioned in Wikipedia but tagged as original research. Nothing much in Google Books or Groups. Equinox 00:25, 3 November 2011 (UTC)

Deleted. - -sche (discuss) 21:13, 5 February 2012 (UTC)


1. "The Gibson." (What does this mean?) 2. "used to quickly indicate agreement with an online forum post." Equinox 18:53, 4 November 2011 (UTC)

RFV-failed. - -sche (discuss) 21:15, 5 February 2012 (UTC)

may gusto ako sayo[edit]

It seems to be the title of a song, but other than that, there are zero hits on Groups or Books. -- Liliana 05:42, 8 November 2011 (UTC)

Deleted. - -sche (discuss) 19:27, 7 February 2012 (UTC)


Overweight person. Created by Wonderfool. Equinox 20:34, 12 November 2011 (UTC)

Extremely verified now!Lucifer

fat bastard (User:Luciferwildcat/fatbastard)[edit]

I think it should be included but another user does not so I will leave it here for consensus.Lucifer 21:32, 13 November 2011 (UTC)

Keep since it is a set phrase inspired by the Austin Powers series, and can also mean "a large amount" something that is not, a meaning cited in the entry. And since CFI says something is "“idiomatic” if its full meaning cannot be easily derived from the meaning of its separate components." "fat bastard" means abundant, & that's not easily obtained from the sum of parts.Lucifer 21:35, 13 November 2011 (UTC)

Delete oops, this is RFV, not RFD. But he has failed to show anything more than sum of parts. Note he's recreated this after I speedied it twice. Equinox 22:18, 13 November 2011 (UTC)
Well I tried to talk to you about it and it does meet the idiomatic inclusion criteria and without the sources and the entry there's no way to show that here, I tried to talk to you about it.Lucifer 22:31, 13 November 2011 (UTC)
Are there citations at Citations:fat bastard that show a meaning that is not easily interpreted as fat + bastard? We may well be missing a sense for the use of fat in invective. DCDuring TALK 23:50, 13 November 2011 (UTC)
Well... there's big fat (apparently under RFD discussion), as in the film title My Big Fat Greek Wedding. Equinox 00:00, 14 November 2011 (UTC)
Same deal here, except this one is also an interjection but it can be used as a prefix and is also a noun, so much use seems to denote a special case here.Lucifer 00:05, 14 November 2011 (UTC)
It's not an intj, any more than shouting "idiot!" or "pervert!" makes them an intj. An intj is something like ouch. And there is no way that fat bastard is a prefix. Honestly without wanting to sound smug and rude I wish you'd study some basic linguistics before you make such bold statements. Equinox 00:10, 14 November 2011 (UTC)
That wasn't nice, your being ridiculous.Lucifer 01:54, 14 November 2011 (UTC)
I'm talking perfect sense, and any linguist would agree that "idiot" and "fat bastard" are not intjs. Are you willing to learn or are you going to keep creating crap and get blocked regularly? Equinox [User_talk:Equinox|◑]] 01:56, 14 November 2011 (UTC)
These are indeed very basic aspects of dictionary work. We are attempting to compete with and surpass the other on-line dictionaries, not just in quantity, but in quality. At the very least we should not be inferior to them in reflecting the most basic facts of usage. There are wonderful sources of information available in print and on-line eg, Google NGram viewer, OneLook.com, COCA, BNC) that enable rank amateurs to become moderately knowledgeable linguists and effective amateur lexicographers. The standard for our work is high. Accurate and useful definitions, citations, etymology, and translations should be accompanied by grammatical information that is correct and useful for those capable of benefiting from it.
Simply advocating a supposed "missing" entry is not a valuable contribution if the advocate:
  1. doesn't understand the rationales for including or excluding entries and
  2. makes it difficult to attract support from others by making very basic mistakes and then failing to correct them and learn from them.
There are numerous shortcomings to our entries, including the absence of modern senses of such basic words as "fat" and "big" in "fat N", "big N", and "big fat N", where N is some noun with a pejorative sense. It is difficult to produce useful definitions of these senses. A start is to have some citations of the usage that clearly distinguish a new sense from older senses. Such citations are really valuable and can provide some opportunity to learn how language evolves. DCDuring TALK 02:38, 14 November 2011 (UTC)

Olive Oyl[edit]

Fictional character. Needs to meet WT:FICTION and possibly (since it's a trademark used for various products and media) WT:BRAND. Equinox 18:41, 15 November 2011 (UTC)

How about this: "she's an Olive Oyl-on-coke type, looks to be about 5'll and 55 lbs" ? Fugyoo 22:46, 15 November 2011 (UTC)
You guys really suck. You demand a lot of time fiddly around formatting citations without giving any hint as to whether they will be acceptable or just a waste of time. Fugyoo 11:35, 17 November 2011 (UTC)
How is this a word or an idiom in a language? Move to RFD if it passes. --Mglovesfun (talk) 11:39, 17 November 2011 (UTC)
For fucks sake what kind of cunts are running this dictionary Fugyoo 11:48, 17 November 2011 (UTC)
You shitbags come along and REQUEST citations, so I waste my time going around looking for them, don't get any feedback on which ones might be acceptable, and then you want it delete it regardless or citations or not. Fucking pricks. If it can't be cited anyway just fucking delete it, morons. Fugyoo 11:51, 17 November 2011 (UTC)
An individual user requested citations. I, a different individual user, am questioning how this can meet CFI as a word or an idiom in a language. --Mglovesfun (talk) 13:22, 17 November 2011 (UTC)
It seems like at least one of you people should be able to answer my goddamn question then (the suggested citation) Fugyoo 16:29, 17 November 2011 (UTC)
To me it seems to be just mentioning the character (like "he had a Robert Smith hairstyle"). But we've got John Lennon glasses so who the hell knows really. The current definition is just naming a single specific character from fiction, so I don't think it belongs in a dictionary but an encyclopaedia. Equinox 12:21, 18 November 2011 (UTC)
Has been deleted. - -sche (discuss) 05:33, 13 February 2012 (UTC)

Child Catcher[edit]

Fictional character. Needs to meet WT:FICTION. Equinox 18:42, 15 November 2011 (UTC)

Has been deleted. - -sche (discuss) 05:33, 13 February 2012 (UTC)

cross-wikti request[edit]

I'd like to ask your help to check these languages. A user that has been blocked at nl.wikt (adding incorrect stuff) has decided to continue at lb.wikt. He/she is mostly adding translations in a wide variety of languages, apparently using machine translations, copy-pasting from Wikipedia, and guessing... :( Curious 08:24, 8 October 2011 (UTC)

So we know which entries to help check: what username(s)? It might be easier for us to go through their Special:Contributions than to go through that category. Do you have an admin on lb.Wikt who can block the user? I see Briséis, but Briséis seems to have been inactive since 2006. - -sche (discuss) 09:19, 8 October 2011 (UTC)
Global sysops can block on lb.wikt, which includes me. Who is that user? -- Liliana 13:44, 8 October 2011 (UTC)
Right now, it is user, but his/her IP changes periodically. These are all the same user:
Just examples, there are probably a lot more IP's that belong to this user. I can't say all his edits are wrong, he has good edits too, but overall his edits contain a lot of errors. He has no idea about the languages he's working on, he's just copy-pasting and using machine translations. Curious 20:35, 8 October 2011 (UTC)
Because he's translating these languages into Limburgish, I don't know if any of us could do any better than him at checking his translations (because we could only use the same machines to translate out of Limburgish, to see what he was saying the English/German/etc words meant)... :/ - -sche (discuss) 04:22, 15 October 2011 (UTC)


"The joy of laughing at others." Only in word lists? Equinox 15:39, 9 October 2011 (UTC)

RFV-failed. - -sche (discuss) 05:26, 13 February 2012 (UTC)

repulsion after orgasm[edit]

Moved from RFD. -- Liliana 05:10, 19 October 2011 (UTC)

Deleted. - -sche (discuss) 05:29, 13 February 2012 (UTC)


Must be an incredibly rare verb if it gets only 150 hits even on Google Web, and none on Books or Groups. -- Liliana 21:49, 21 October 2011 (UTC)

RFV-failed. - -sche (discuss) 05:30, 13 February 2012 (UTC)

up gazes[edit]


moved from RFD. The base form says "plural not attested", so how come these exist? -- Liliana 12:57, 11 October 2011 (UTC)

Basically, the user who created the entries changed his mind. Mglovesfun (talk) 20:39, 14 October 2011 (UTC)
Unlike upgazes, these forms don't seem to be attested. I've deleted them. - -sche (discuss) 05:11, 14 March 2012 (UTC)

misc 3[edit]


Rfv-senses: "2. Used to place emphasis on certain adjectives or noun adjuncts used as adjectives" and "3. Used to indicate something that can be considered fantastic or fantastical"; not sure what common procedure is for verifying affixes but especially sense 3 sounds dubious. — lexicógrafa | háblame — 16:43, 17 October 2011 (UTC)

Deleted for now. - -sche (discuss) 06:28, 18 March 2012 (UTC)


The whole entry is really suspect.

First of all, there's a Translingual entry at the very top. I highly doubt any medicine terms can be properly considered "translingual", since languages like Chinese obviously won't use these. In the page history, it can be seen this used to be an English term - we should return to that.

Directly below is a Latin section, but the etymology gives it as a New Latin term. Was this ever used in Latin proper? -- Liliana 13:43, 18 October 2011 (UTC)

If both fail RFV, we can revert back to Visvisa's initial version, which is just plain 'English'. Latin only needs one citation as a dead language, for the translingual, not sure how to cite it. Would three citations in any language suffice? And if it therefore passed, wouldn't the Latin be redundant to the Translingual? Mglovesfun (talk) 22:01, 18 October 2011 (UTC)
In Wiktionary I thought "translingual" just meant "several languages", not "all languages". There are thousands (probably) of "translingual" definitions for Chinese characters, even though these characters are obviously used in only a very small fraction of the world's languages. 13:41, 23 October 2011 (UTC)
There was some discussion (which I can't find right now) about replacing all of pizza with a single Translingual section, since it is used in quite a lot of the world's languages. This suggestion was rejected for several reasons. We should probably do the same here. -- Liliana 13:57, 23 October 2011 (UTC)
Translingual section deleted (replaced with the old English section). Latin section kept, because I assume it's used in New Latin, and New Latin is Latin for the purposes of L2 headers. - -sche (discuss) 06:37, 18 March 2012 (UTC)


Rfv-sense: A communal burrow of prairie dogs.

Dictionaries do not have this sense. Added by an anon in this revision. --Dan Polansky 08:42, 19 October 2011 (UTC)

google books:coterie "prairie dog" yields, for example: "A characteristic feature of all prairie dog species is coloniality. Black-tailed prairie dog (Cynomys ludovicianus) colonies are organized into family groups, called coteries, which are harem-polygynous units." — Xavier, 23:33, 17 November 2011 (UTC)
Cited. - -sche (discuss) 05:53, 21 March 2012 (UTC)

calva [edit]

I just created the English entry, going on the the information given in w:Calva; however, the OED has no entry in any sense for calva, so I bring our new entry here for verification. — Raifʻhār Doremítzwr ~ (U · T · C) ~ 11:45, 19 October 2011 (UTC)

Perhaps it should be moved to the Spanish section. There may be different varieties of the game. According to the Diccionario de la lengua española of the Real Academia Española the game consists of trying to hit the upper part of a log with pebbles. --Hekaheka 21:14, 19 October 2011 (UTC)
Search Google Books for "broken calva" and you'll see sufficiently many hits for the second etymology. (To my surprise, only calvae, not calvas is attested as the plural of that sense, at least in my not-that-determined search.)
Search for "glass of calva" and "two calvas" and you will likewise see hits for the third etymology. I have combined "brandy" and "a glass of this brandy" rather than cite each individually.
I have not looked for the first etymology yet. I will look for it later. - -sche (discuss) 06:15, 21 March 2012 (UTC)
Well, the obvious search for sense 1 of etyl 1, "play calva", turns up exactly nothing. "Down the calva" (designed to find hits of "knock|ed|ing down the calva") finds only one hit of the brandy sense. "Clear calva" (because the sport is "so named after the field on which the game is played, which is cleared of any obstacles") also finds nothing. It may be best to take Heka's suggestion and move etyl 1 to the Spanish section. - -sche (discuss) 06:19, 21 March 2012 (UTC)
"Pequeño Larousse Ilustrado" gives these definitions to "calva"
  • Parte de la cabeza donde se ha caído el pelo
  • Espacio de tierra sin árboles en un bosque
  • Especie de juego de bolos que se hace con un cuerno y piedras
"RAE"'s definitions are:
  • Parte de la cabeza de la que se ha caído el pelo
  • Parte de una piel, felpa u otro tejido semejante que ha perdido el pelo por el uso
  • Sitio en los sembrados, plantíos y arbolados donde falta la vegetación correspondiente
  • Juego que consiste en tirar los jugadores a proporcianada distancia piedras a la parte superior de un madero sin tocar antes en tierra.
  • de almete, Parte superior de esta pieza de armatura que cubre el cránco --Hekaheka (talk) 07:24, 21 March 2012 (UTC)

Moved the game to the Spanish section, removed rfv. --Hekaheka (talk) 08:19, 21 March 2012 (UTC)


Rfv-senses: both adjective senses. For example I think the cricket sense is always the verb 'drop' used in the passive voice. Like 'he was dropped', 'he had already been dropped'. You can say a 'dropped batsman' but the batsman can't be 'more dropped than' or 'very dropped'. Mglovesfun (talk) 16:06, 21 October 2011 (UTC)

  • Well, one batsman could be dropped more often than another. (but yes, they are probably just uses of the past participle) SemperBlotto 16:13, 21 October 2011 (UTC)
    • Something like the 'most dropped batsman in history' is not different from 'the most attacked house in history'. Still feels like a verb form to me. Mglovesfun (talk) 16:20, 21 October 2011 (UTC)
      Do I understand correctly that not only a ball, but a batsman can be dropped? That is, a dropped ball leads to a dropped batsman? Can one say "He dropped X twice today", where X is a batsman? If so, there would seem to be a missing cricket sense of drop#verb. DCDuring TALK 17:57, 21 October 2011 (UTC)
    • Not quite - a batsman is said to be dropped when a fielder drops the ball. "X was dropped on 15 but went on to score a century." SemperBlotto 18:56, 21 October 2011 (UTC)
      • I think the verb drop does merit a cricket sense, as when the batsman is dropped, he's not literally suspended from a height and then dropped, the ball which he has hit is dropped. Mglovesfun (talk) 19:31, 21 October 2011 (UTC)
Resolved. Adjective section removed. - -sche (discuss) 07:06, 22 March 2012 (UTC)


Rfv-sense: (computing) An early RISC personal computer. Moved from RFD, needs citations meeting brand name criteria. -- Liliana 03:42, 28 October 2011 (UTC)

  • See its citations page. SemperBlotto 07:11, 28 October 2011 (UTC)
RFV-kept as cited. If you dispute that the citations meet BRAND or other applicable standards, raise the issue on RFD (or reopen this RFV). - -sche (discuss) 01:15, 11 March 2012 (UTC)



  • Mulligan stew.
  • A second chance.
  • (informal) A unit of measure equal to 62.5 milliliters, or 2.5 shots, of alcohol.

Moved from RFD, where it was claimed that only the (non-tagged) golf sense actually exists, and the others apparently don't. -- Liliana 16:25, 30 October 2011 (UTC)

I have heard the second-chance sense used, mostly by golfers, but outside the context of golfing. It is reasonable that someone would understand this broader use. I think it might even be "widespread use", but citations are always good. DCDuring TALK 22:54, 31 October 2011 (UTC)
I've cited the chance and stew senses.​—msh210 (talk) 17:18, 1 November 2011 (UTC)
There are no Web (!) hits for "a mulligan of rum|gin|whiskey|whisky|bourbon|scotch".​—msh210 (talk) 17:28, 1 November 2011 (UTC)
I actually happen to have heard and personally used this term in the card game w:Magic the Gathering. Taking a mulligan means to shuffle your initial hand back into the deck and draw for the second time, but one less card than the initial draw, should you get a bad hand. This complies with the second definition: A second chance.. I also believe that this usage is indeed taken from its usage in golf. JamesjiaoTC 20:59, 3 November 2011 (UTC)
The unit of measurement is off, anyway -- one shot is 1.5 ounces in the US, or 44.36... ml. Rounding up for easier math gives us 45 ml. 2.5 shots would be 3.75 oz or (roughly speaking) 112.5 ml, or more exactly (when converting from 3.75 oz) 110.9... ml.
I have no idea where this 62.5 ml measurement came from. Any bar serving shots of only 25 ml would not stay open for very long. -- Eiríkr ÚtlendiTala við mig 20:39, 6 November 2011 (UTC)
Cited senses pass, thank you msh210! Other sense fails. - -sche (discuss) 05:53, 22 March 2012 (UTC)


Possibly not attestable: google books:"monsterise", google groups:"monsterise". If attested, then it should be at least tagged as rare.

Current definitions:

  • To make another into a monster
  • To give another very bad reputation

--Dan Polansky 08:47, 7 November 2011 (UTC)

A quick search on the spelling with a "Z" (google books:"monsterize", google groups:"monsterize") shows 10x and 5.5x more common use, respectively. google scholar:"monsterise" finds one single citation, while google scholar:"monsterize" finds 25 hits. -- HTH, Eiríkr ÚtlendiTala við mig 19:59, 7 November 2011 (UTC)
Majorly attestable dude!Lucifer 01:21, 13 November 2011 (UTC)
One sense RFV-failed, other sense kept. The entry could still use cleanup. - -sche (discuss) 06:44, 18 March 2012 (UTC)


Three separate senses, yet this is not even CFI-attestable in one sense from Google Books. It also reads like a bitter man trying to criticise women under the veil of scientific terminology. (He also created this: [22].) Equinox 11:36, 12 November 2011 (UTC)

Reading that made me really sad. Sorry. -- Liliana 01:57, 13 November 2011 (UTC)
I found it kinda funny actually, but if taken seriously it could be very offensive, nevertheless if people are actually using fembot to describe a "talking points but otherwise ignorant feminist automaton" perhaps that is an additional {{context|pejorative|lang=und}} sense worth adding?Lucifer 03:37, 13 November 2011 (UTC)
Interestingly, this term does seem to be mostly pejorative / negative, unlike the neutral feminocentrism, which I just corrected the def of. Geefdee 18:22, 19 February 2012 (UTC)
Thanks for adding that one quotation. Unfortunately, I could find no others, so this fails RFV. - -sche (discuss) 06:59, 18 March 2012 (UTC)


The sole absolutely horrible citation needs to be replaced by three that... well, don't suck. — [Ric Laurent] — 03:58, 16 November 2011 (UTC)

I couldn't find much, but this term is really used, it's the verb for tribadism and I vouch for it.Lucifer 05:57, 16 November 2011 (UTC)
Hmm, if it's a verb (and the usex shows verb use), perhaps it shouldn't be under a ===Noun=== header? -- Eiríkr ÚtlendiTala við mig 06:39, 16 November 2011 (UTC)
  • Google Books: "She loved tribbing and knew that this was going to be a great experience. Roxy was not disapointed because once their pussies were together, Helga was like an animal hunching hard and groaning."
  • Lesbian Sex Tips, Tricks & Techniques has a chapter about tribbing (on google books, p. 73)
There are also some hits in Google News archives. Fugyoo 10:52, 16 November 2011 (UTC)
Sorry I wasn't clear -- I'm not refuting that a noun sense exists, but rather wondering why the usex for the noun is in fact a verb form. -- Eiríkr ÚtlendiTala við mig 16:08, 16 November 2011 (UTC)
Because it's Troy. He has yet to learn a lot of the terms used here. — [Ric Laurent] — 18:07, 16 November 2011 (UTC)
I didn't create this entry, its clearly a noun entry for what is in reality a verb, all I did was expand the entry with a cite.Lucifer 19:00, 16 November 2011 (UTC)
Lol I apologize for that, the original creator (Chuletadechancho (talkcontribs)) of the entry added that usex. It looked like your style of writing, and you've made a number of similar slips. Anyway, the "quotation" you added is still atrocious. It'd be nice if it had some good ones. — [Ric Laurent] — 20:14, 16 November 2011 (UTC)
I really appreciate that, I hope we could keep getting along in this manner and that makes sense, the subject matter is my forte which is what piqued my interest in the first place. That was the best citation I could find, I know dictionary defs are bad, and that they are usually copyvios so I tried an except approach. This is definitely a legit term, I guess there is a mountain of man on man action in literature but lesbians don't seem to have to much sex in print, or I'm not good at finding it, I think both are likely as I am allergic to lesbians and only like girly girl heterosexual girls.Lucifer 10:24, 17 November 2011 (UTC)
I've added two books; other citations are available on Usenet, although there's also a lot of crap, and I've marked the term {{rare}}. - -sche (discuss) 06:19, 22 March 2012 (UTC)


This just looks like a misspelling to me. — [Ric Laurent] — 12:08, 16 November 2011 (UTC)

It's the Anglo-French spelling according to the Online Etymology Dictionary. —CodeCat 22:40, 16 November 2011 (UTC)
Our etymology section for mayhem lists some similar spellings, but we still need citations — [Ric Laurent] — 22:46, 16 November 2011 (UTC)
Just following redlinks here, not crazy about obsolete english here.Lucifer 10:29, 17 November 2011 (UTC)
Sounds plausible as an obsolete spelling, I'll look into it before the end of the day. --Mglovesfun (talk) 11:41, 17 November 2011 (UTC)
It seems to specifically refer to maiming (mayhem sense #3), for example in this legal glossary first published in the 19th Century. --Mglovesfun (talk) 13:27, 17 November 2011 (UTC)
The OED just treats it as an obsolete spelling, without attaching any particular sense to that spelling, though the fact that the "i" spelling comes from French law suggests that a legal interpretation will be more common. Dbfirs 17:14, 17 November 2011 (UTC)
Is there a good sources for old english and old spellings in general?Lucifer 23:09, 17 November 2011 (UTC)
Reminds me of the spelling reform article “Meihem in ce Klasrum”. ~ Robin (talk) 19:50, 13 March 2012 (UTC)
I see more than a thousand hits on Google Books for this spelling, and they seem to substantiate what's been said about old legal usage. Therefore, I've removed the tag from the entry and am striking this as kept. Mg has given the entry a good definition. - -sche (discuss) 07:21, 18 March 2012 (UTC)


Appears to be a brand name or something. WT:BRAND[Ric Laurent] — 20:03, 16 November 2011 (UTC)

But this is just the origin of the verb, which is a proprietary technology for a product used by millions, it's in every Android device, and the way it works is that for Troy for example you tap on the t and draw a continuos like to the r-o-[and]-y and then you let go and the word troy appears and it is very rapid, much faster than typing physical keys or tapping tactile electronic representations of ones as well. And it is being used as a verb, i.e. "sorry, I swyped that wrong", or "my swype did that", or "i swyped you a message" or "i love swyping"Lucifer 20:08, 16 November 2011 (UTC)

Wiktionary:CFI#Spanning_at_least_a_year. This is why we have tweet, but maybe not some other nonce stuff that never caught on. If it's not been around for a year, then we don't keep it. — [Ric Laurent] — 21:39, 16 November 2011 (UTC)
Looks like it is too new to meet WT:CFI this year. Nothing on Usenet. Also the verb entry looks suspect because it is capitalised Swype but the other forms are swyping etc. in lower case. Equinox 20:10, 16 November 2011 (UTC)
I only capitalized it because I thought all brand-derived words have to be. Swype has been around since 2010 if not 2009, so it does span a year. Android phones have definitely caught on, they outnumber iphones 2-1 i believe.Lucifer 10:26, 17 November 2011 (UTC)
This is requests for verification. When you just come and say "OH YEAH IT DOES EXIST" that is of no help in building a scholarly dictionary. Please find citations that MEET THE CRITERIA AT WT:CFI. I don't believe there are enough, if any. Equinox 10:48, 17 November 2011 (UTC)
The verb "to swype" may well come into common usage, but, if it does, it will be with a lower-case "s". The capitalised form obviously refers to the proprietary technology and software. I can find uses only in blogs so far. Dbfirs 09:40, 19 November 2011 (UTC)
Are blogs valid?Lucifer 08:34, 27 November 2011 (UTC)
No. --Yair rand 23:01, 28 November 2011 (UTC)
This is in use though.Lucifer 18:00, 2 December 2011 (UTC)
Where can we find it in print, other than in blogs? Dbfirs 16:50, 12 December 2011 (UTC)
RFV-failed, as far as I can tell. - -sche (discuss) 06:22, 22 March 2012 (UTC)


New entry by Special:Contributions/, not the other IP user who has similar interests but no competence--so don't hold that against this contributer. However I can't find this word in any dictionary, but it looks very much like 手前, which is pronounced colloquially as temē, which sounds like "teme" to a Westerner's ears, and might have the same meaning in context, since it is a rude form of "you." Should this point to 手前--which needs a little work too, as it lists a pronoun as a noun--or is this something else? Thanks Haplology 18:30, 19 November 2011 (UTC)

♬ Booooooooguuuuuus. ♫ (Imagine a foghorn kind of sound. :) This looks like a pretty clear case of a non-Japanese speaker trying to add Japanese entries without knowing the language. I strongly agree that this entry was added in ignorance of the fact that the word is temē, spelled variously 手前, テメー, or てめえ, among other variations. I'd say move to テメー and edit into a stub entry pointing to 手前. -- Eiríkr ÚtlendiTala við mig 05:41, 20 November 2011 (UTC)
I thought so. At least we can say it's bogus in good faith. I happened on a real テメ, although probably rarely written in katakana, namely 手目. Maybe we can keep the page but replace the current definition with one for 手目. Haplology 14:07, 20 November 2011 (UTC)
Perhaps - how often is it written in katakana, though? If it's extremely rare, it might make more sense to have the stub entry at てめ instead. -- Eiríkr ÚtlendiTala við mig 18:32, 20 November 2011 (UTC)
Oh, dear -- it looks like this same IP user created an identically mistaken entry at てめ. -- Eiríkr ÚtlendiTala við mig 18:38, 20 November 2011 (UTC)
My question is, why the hell would it be written in katakana (other than for styling reasons)? If it is indeed a loanword, then... where was it borrowed from? JamesjiaoTC 01:50, 28 November 2011 (UTC)
The katakana is a big hint that this user is coming from a background in manga -- manga authors/artists love to use offbeat styling to catch people's eyes, and katakana is a common part of that. I cannot think of any possible borrowed word that would be spelled テメ. -- Eiríkr ÚtlendiTala við mig 18:43, 28 November 2011 (UTC)
The original entry has been deleted as RFV-failed. Other editors are working on talk pages to sort out whether or not to keep the current entry, "deception". - -sche (discuss) 21:21, 22 March 2012 (UTC)

buck wild[edit]

Noun sense (synonyms are adjectives) SemperBlotto 08:13, 7 December 2011 (UTC)

It's an adjective. Creator just seems to be unaware. — [Ric Laurent] — 11:33, 7 December 2011 (UTC)
It is an adjective isn't it, but don't most words have a noun sense as well?Lucifer 12:37, 7 December 2011 (UTC)
No... — [Ric Laurent] — 12:54, 7 December 2011 (UTC)

I am buck wild. (NOUN!).Lucifer 13:49, 7 December 2011 (UTC)

Um, no. Also, in I am here, here is not a noun (it's an adverb); in I am going, going is not a noun (it's a verb); and in I am angry, angry is not a noun (it's an adjective).​—msh210 (talk) 14:49, 7 December 2011 (UTC)
Similarly "I am ignorant" (adjective), but "I am an ignoramus" (noun). SemperBlotto 16:41, 7 December 2011 (UTC)
I remember reading a semi-scholarly book several years ago on African American Vernacular English which defined "buck" by itself as "extremely" or something like that, so actually "buck wild" is a sum-of-parts phrase, although I can't think of any other ways to use "buck." If I remember correctly it was Black Talk by Geneva Smitherman, but I could be wrong, it was a long time ago. Haplology 14:34, 7 December 2011 (UTC)
Buck naked??​—msh210 (talk) 14:49, 7 December 2011 (UTC)
I've heard "buck naked" but I'm not sure if that was just a poor pronunciation of "butt naked". Though it seems to be super common online, so I guess it's possible that the poor pronunciation was misunderstood and subsequently transcribed as buck. Anyway. Wusilyunseung. — [Ric Laurent] — 14:59, 7 December 2011 (UTC)
Note: Heading has been changed to Adjective, but definition is still for that of a noun. SemperBlotto 08:59, 8 December 2011 (UTC)
fixedLucifer 21:35, 8 December 2011 (UTC)
Nope. "Definition" is now Related to encompassing timultuosness, debauchery, partying and typically: uncharacteristically inappropriate behavior such as exaggerated sexual, narcotic, and rulebreaking conduct. First part doesn't make much sense to me (Related to encompassing timultuosness?), second part (uncharacteristically inappropriate behavior) is still a noun. SemperBlotto 08:26, 9 December 2011 (UTC)
Noun RFV-failed and long ago deleted. Adjective cleaned up and kept. - -sche (discuss) 19:46, 21 March 2012 (UTC)

candy cane[edit]

Rfv-sense: "A playing card with the rank of seven". Never heard of it, and Urban Dictionary ain't got it Purplebackpack89 (Notes Taken) (Locker) 14:47, 9 December 2011 (UTC)

List of playing-card nicknames includes "candy cane", "hockey stick", and "walking stick" for 7, so it's apparently something to do with the shape of the pips. I tried a brief search on poker newsgroups (good for card slang) but found nothing. Equinox 14:54, 9 December 2011 (UTC)
I think it has to do with the fact that a seven looks like a candy cane...FYI, the reference currently there doesn't turn up anything for "candy cane", and we'd need two more anyways Purplebackpack89 (Notes Taken) (Locker) 15:41, 9 December 2011 (UTC)
Usually used for pocket pairs, so a pair of eights is 'snowmen' but an eight is not normally 'a snowman'. So try citing candy canes as opposed to candy cane. I've not heard of this one; walking sticks is the one I've heard of. Mglovesfun (talk) 16:06, 9 December 2011 (UTC)
RFV-failed. - -sche (discuss) 19:49, 21 March 2012 (UTC)


-- Liliana 17:44, 13 December 2011 (UTC)

Urban dictionary has it, and you can find "10q very much" with Google. — TAKASUGI Shinji (talk) 02:45, 17 December 2011 (UTC)
There are sufficiently many his on Usenet for "10q very much" (the phrase Takasugi suggests), so I've detagged this and kept it. I'm trying not to make people, including myself, spend time formating citations that clearly exist. - -sche (discuss) 19:52, 21 March 2012 (UTC)


Not in OneLook or OED. Needs a proper headword if OK. SemperBlotto 08:00, 17 December 2011 (UTC)

Most ghits are mentions or surnames, but we can probably find three good cites. Should it have an "archaic" tag? Dbfirs 22:50, 17 December 2011 (UTC)
Looks real, but archaic. Some mentions in lists produced for genealogy studies. [23] [24] , and [25].--Dmol 03:54, 20 December 2011 (UTC)
"Corn merchant" sense cited; "one who mans a booth" sense added; both senses cited... :) - -sche (discuss) 20:28, 21 March 2012 (UTC)

infinite spin[edit]

This would need to meet WT:FICTION. -- Liliana 19:45, 20 December 2011 (UTC)

It doesn't seem like fiction at all, more like slang or jargon. —CodeCat 20:01, 20 December 2011 (UTC)
I don't see how Tetris is a fictional universe any more than chess is. Mglovesfun (talk) 11:03, 21 December 2011 (UTC)
Last time I checked, chess was an actual board game played with actual pieces on actual boards. Dunno if that is still the case, but you can't say the same about Tetris. -- Liliana 12:57, 21 December 2011 (UTC)
But there's also computer chess. There is nothing "fictional" about Tetris. Equinox 20:24, 21 December 2011 (UTC)
Even if you consider Tetris to take place in a fictional universe, this term doesn't originate in that universe: it originates among real-world players. (Assuming the term is real at all, I mean.) —RuakhTALK 21:37, 21 December 2011 (UTC)
Deleted as uncited. - -sche (discuss) 04:46, 10 March 2012 (UTC)


Claimed to be a singular noun with plural elfens or elfene. This might be true but in the sole citation for this PoS elfen is much more easily read as a plural of elf. DCDuring TALK 23:31, 20 December 2011 (UTC)

Said sole citation is definitely using elfen in reference to a different, but clearly elf-inspired, fictional race; the work in question uses elfen as both singular and plural, though, so there's no way to tell which one the citation is. Regardless, it doesn't support the "female elf" sense. (And I'm confident that it's not durably archived, anyway.) —RuakhTALK 19:55, 21 December 2011 (UTC)
This was my creation. I was going back to edit it since I wasn't satisfied ... It's been totally redone in a few days so much that it is now messed up (even the wiki reference is wrong). Here's what I intend to do. I'm going to mark the noun as historical rather than archaic, since it is mainly used by historians ... and this is the quote that I'm going to put in: Whatever external influences they may reflect, the female elfen came into being in pre-Conquest England. The second quote shows the plural elfenne: Archaic forms are again apparent, in the form feldælbinne, itself glossed with a tenth-century Kentish form familiar to the scribe, elfenne,. I'm also going to put this all back under the one etym. Really ... if folks can't see that elfen came from OE elfen ... they need to get their eyes checked.
As for the story I quoted, as I recall, the race was entirely female ... no males were ever mentioned. It may be that the author was going to introduce them later, but never did. That's why put it in there for a quote. Since you've cleaned it up. I may leave it. I was thinking about taking it out.
And yes, elfen is also a plural of elfe (f) ... another female form. I have found three female forms in the singular (elfe, elfen, elven) in English ... the whole elf and it's derivatives is a jumbled mess. The adjectives are elvish, elfish, elven, elfen, elfin. I'v seen them all! BTW, German borrowed Elf (m), Elfe (f), Elfen (pl) from English.
I think this should take care of the rfv. I'll let you take it out if it does. --AnWulf ... Ferþu Hal! 23:14, 23 December 2011 (UTC)
There are still no valid quotations. The Alaric Hall quotes do not use the word (they merely mention it), and the story is not durably archived. (Also, the story does indeed have males, as in the paragraph "Laeri's life-mate was Kerris Seesfar. He had glossy chestnut fur and eyes as brown as pine-cones. In his mane, as well as the carved bone warrior-rings, he wore jay's feathers, for he was the greatest hunter of the grove - even the bears moved softly in the woods for fear of Kerris Seesfar. He was our ancestor too, a fine and skillful hunter, strong and brave.") —RuakhTALK 20:44, 1 January 2012 (UTC)
RFV-failed. - -sche (discuss) 07:39, 18 March 2012 (UTC)

beaver buster[edit]

Moving from RFD per discussion at WT:RFD#beaver buster. Copy of that discussion below. -- Eiríkr ÚtlendiTala við mig 19:27, 21 December 2011 (UTC)

The cites given, and others on Google Books, aren't enough IMHO --Simplus2 21:51, 20 December 2011 (UTC)

Speedily move to RFV (bad nomination). Mglovesfun (talk) 21:53, 20 December 2011 (UTC)
Keep this is a really common term and the nominator's rationale is a verification one not a CFI one so move to RFVLucifer 22:33, 20 December 2011 (UTC)
Luciferwildcat has had two citations... neither of which are any good. One specific says that it's a pseudonym for a person, one doesn't use it in a sentence but just on its own, so one conveys a different meaning to the one in the entry, one conveys no meaning. Mglovesfun (talk) 20:05, 12 January 2012 (UTC)
Deleted. - -sche (discuss) 20:31, 21 March 2012 (UTC)

misc 4[edit]

bigger (singular noun)[edit]

I can't think of a way to use this noun sense ("someone bigger than oneself") in the singular. Fugyoo 10:37, 19 October 2011 (UTC)


Anyone have an argument for keeping this, or a link to cites? If not, I'll delete this as uncited, so that the content will only be at the plural... although [[better#Noun]] has a singular noun section. - -sche (discuss) 05:46, 22 March 2012 (UTC)
Added two cites for a total of three. It looks like a plural-only noun. BenjaminBarrett12 (talk) 21:37, 25 March 2012 (UTC)
Duly moved. - -sche (discuss) 00:32, 27 March 2012 (UTC)


Rfv-sense: of or pertaining to a thousands years. Ƿidsiþ 07:07, 22 October 2011 (UTC)

I have deleted the sense "Of or pertaining to a thousand years" as RFV-failed. I have added and cited the sense "Lasting or expected to last a thousand years". - -sche (discuss) 18:07, 24 March 2012 (UTC)


Rfv-sense x 4:

  1. To provide soup or a meal.
  2. To dine on soup, to eat soup.
  3. To soak up liquid or sauce from a dish with a piece of bread and eat it.
  4. (informal) To improve something by making it more powerful, elaborate or impressive (Cf. soup up)

The first three are plausible, but it would definitely be nice to know if they are current or dated or literary. The last informal sense may not exist apart from soup up. If it is deemed worthwhile, then we should make sure that this page has an etymology reflecting the "influence" of supercharge on this sense. DCDuring TALK 00:53, 25 October 2011 (UTC)

The third one may be getting confused with sop. 15:56, 28 October 2011 (UTC)
I've added a photography sense with citations, and cited the "to provide with soup" sense, and tagged it as an uncommon variant of "to [[feed]]". The other senses I've deleted as RFV-failed. - -sche (discuss) 19:32, 24 March 2012 (UTC)


I wonder what sort of attesting quotations can be provided for this entry. Some searches: google books:3qorz, google groups:3qorz. --Dan Polansky 08:57, 1 November 2011 (UTC)

I seem to find more with 3Q得orz, such as [26] and here. —Stephen (Talk) 09:47, 1 November 2011 (UTC)
"I seem to find more with 3Q得orz", which makes perfect sense, particle (de) is used to form resultative verbs, so 3Q = thank you, "Orz" looks as a prostrated person (to prostrate = 五体投地). The phrase 感谢五体投地 is made the same way - "thanking you as to prostrate myself". In 3Q得orz the "orz" part is non-verbal, it's like a picture. --Anatoli 10:08, 1 November 2011 (UTC)
Isn't this sum-of-parts anyway? Can 3Q and orz not be attested separately? Fugyoo 10:51, 1 November 2011 (UTC)
(after an edit conflict)I doubt it. "3Qorz" and "3Q得orz" could perhaps be considered synonyms, 3Q or 三Q (三 = 3) can be used separately but "orz" not. In fact, in one of the quotes above the meaning of "orz" is described as an emoticon (表情符號), not a word, as it is not a very common term or "symbol". --Anatoli 11:03, 1 November 2011 (UTC)

I've never heard of or seen anyone use this. Phrases using 得 to form resultative verbs are probably in most cases sum of parts (can't think of an exception right now). Hbrug 10:56, 1 November 2011 (UTC)

User:A-cai has created it. He is from Taiwan, so it may be used in Taiwan? --Anatoli 11:03, 1 November 2011 (UTC)
This is pretty common Internet slang, I'm surprised you haven't seen it before Hbrug. Unfortunately I don't think it's attestable according to Wiktionary's CFI since we seem to rely solely on archivable sources. ---> Tooironic 22:09, 1 November 2011 (UTC)
It's what the Chinese call w:Martian language/w:火星文. Essentially it's a series of symbols used in Internet slang that are otherwise not understandable by the everyday crowd. This one is.. unfortunately.. valid and easily citable as an Internet slang term. Obviously I haven't lived in China for a long time, so I am not quite versed with the Internet culture that's present there. JamesjiaoTC 21:47, 3 November 2011 (UTC)
They must be separated to 3q and orz. The latter is probably from Japanese internet community. — TAKASUGI Shinji (talk) 01:47, 5 December 2011 (UTC)
Moved to Talk:3qorz, because I could find no durably archived citations (RFV-failed). - -sche (discuss) 18:17, 24 March 2012 (UTC)


Chiranthodendron pentadactyllon. Apparently this is the "Mexican devil's hand tree"...? Equinox 01:43, 14 November 2011 (UTC)

Searches for "manita-tree" and "manitas"+"tree" find some hits that are using "manita" to mean a particular kind of tree, but I can't say what kind. - -sche (discuss) 07:13, 22 March 2012 (UTC)
[[27]] has "hand-flower tree," "tree of the little hands," "monkey's hand" and "devil's hand" for Chiranthodendron pentadactylon. BenjaminBarrett12 (talk) 08:09, 22 March 2012 (UTC)
Cited as "manita tree" — should the entry be moved to [[manita tree]]? - -sche (discuss) 20:13, 24 March 2012 (UTC)
I'm not against creating a new entry for manita tree, but manita is used alone, as attested by two quotations I have just added. — Xavier, 22:53, 25 March 2012 (UTC)
Hmmm, now, considering the quotes, I'm wondering if manita is not the flower rather than the tree. — Xavier, 22:56, 25 March 2012 (UTC)
Hm, interesting question. I've started looking for more citations. I found one of manitas=tree, Citations:manitas. - -sche (discuss) 00:05, 26 March 2012 (UTC)
If we define manita as the flower (which is what the citations support), does that make manita tree SOP? If so, we can just leave all the quotations where they are, and not create manita tree. - -sche (discuss) 00:49, 26 March 2012 (UTC)
OK. I have added two more citations attesting that manita also refers to the tree. Thank you for helping, I think you can close this case now. — Xavier, 20:40, 26 March 2012 (UTC)
I've broadened the definition to "The tree Chiranthodendron pentadactyllon, or the red, hand-like flower this tree produces." to account for all the citations. - -sche (discuss) 22:34, 26 March 2012 (UTC)


Dated form of weight. Suspect they are typos/scannos in Google Books. Equinox 01:57, 14 November 2011 (UTC)

Uno, dos, tres. --Pilcrow 02:00, 14 November 2011 (UTC)
I still think they are typos/scannos. Does any other dictionary have this? Equinox 02:03, 14 November 2011 (UTC)
I'd say it's a mistake on the analogy of height, which etymologically is high + -th and which used to have heighth as a common alternative form. But weight is not from that suffix (at least, not unless you go really far back). On the other hand, in the books cited by Pilcrow, weight is used consistently apart from those individual sentences, so they're probably typos. Ƿidsiþ 08:28, 14 November 2011 (UTC)
Yes, just errors. I can also find cites for "weighth" when "eighth" was intended, but I don't claim that this is an "old spelling"! Many (but not all) of the mis-spellings I've found are by authors for whom English is not their first language, but perhaps we could have a "mis-spelling of" entry? Even "really far back" in the word's thousand-year history, there was never a spelling weighth, not even in Anglo-Saxon! Dbfirs 22:30, 14 November 2011 (UTC)
Deleted. - -sche (discuss) 20:03, 23 March 2012 (UTC)

I have found some good citations for this. Three that Pilcrow has above, plus one more. These are not scanning issues.

  1. First, a citation where "weighth" is clearly a spelling error for "weight": http://books.google.com/books?id=MytFAAAAcAAJ&pg=PA447&dq=%22weighth%22&hl=en&sa=X&ei=wCtuT8WkO-O1iQea4cS5CA&ved=0CFEQ6AEwAw#v=onepage&q=%22weighth%22&f=false
  2. Next, a citation in which the rules of spelling are explained, and the "th" in the theoretical "weighth" is reduced to "weight": http://books.google.com/books?id=0vUDAAAAQAAJ&pg=PA2&dq=%22weighth%22&hl=en&sa=X&ei=wCtuT8WkO-O1iQea4cS5CA&ved=0CHQQ6AEwCQ#v=onepage&q=%22weighth%22&f=false
  3. But here are three clear citations: http://books.google.com/books?id=2UcZAAAAYAAJ&pg=PA189&dq=%22weighth%22&hl=en&sa=X&ei=VyxuT8qLBsqhiAfP9MiMBg&ved=0CFkQ6AEwBA#v=onepage&q=%22weighth%22&f=false
  4. http://books.google.com/books?id=9PYRAAAAYAAJ&pg=PA270&dq=%22weighth%22&hl=en&sa=X&ei=VyxuT8qLBsqhiAfP9MiMBg&ved=0CHEQ6AEwCA#v=onepage&q=%22weighth%22&f=false
  5. http://books.google.com/books?id=pWwDAAAAQAAJ&pg=PA349&dq=%22weighth%22&hl=en&sa=X&ei=wCtuT8WkO-O1iQea4cS5CA&ved=0CFcQ6AEwBA#v=onepage&q=%22weighth%22&f=false
  6. One more: http://books.google.com/books?id=g01CAQAAIAAJ&pg=PA649&dq=%22weighth%22&hl=en&sa=X&ei=wCtuT8WkO-O1iQea4cS5CA&ved=0CEwQ6AEwAg#v=onepage&q=%22weighth%22&f=false
Alright, I've restored the entry and made it a "misspelling of" entry. - -sche (discuss) 20:48, 24 March 2012 (UTC)

Stihl saw[edit]

Nominating my own creation (fair's fair). I think this is actually a branded product, I first though it was an eponym, that is named after the person who invented it, but I think it's actually a specific grinder made by Stilh (which may be valid as a surname) which is a company. Mglovesfun (talk) 22:49, 25 November 2011 (UTC)

Shouldn't it by Stihl, not Stilh.--Dmol 11:28, 26 November 2011 (UTC)
Ok done. Mglovesfun (talk) 11:35, 26 November 2011 (UTC)
Stihl makes chainsaws, among other equipment (just as do Husqvarna, Homelite, Craftsman and many other manufacturers). Originally, Stihl chainsaws ran on gasoline, but in recent years all the manufacturers have come out with electric models (plug-in) as well as cordless ones that have rechargeable batteries. So, a Stihl saw is not just a cordless chainsaw, it is any type of chainsaw made by Stihl. —Stephen (Talk) 11:42, 26 November 2011 (UTC)
There may have been a time after w:Stihl developed the gasoline-powered chainsaw in 1926 when all chainsaws were sometimes called Stihl saws. World War II probably put an end to that in the English-speaking world. DCDuring TALK 18:17, 29 November 2011 (UTC)
I found no support for the above conjecture. DCDuring TALK 00:31, 1 December 2011 (UTC)
In current usage, this is just Stihl (a brand name) + saw. I don't know about earlier. — lexicógrafa | háblame — 18:20, 29 November 2011 (UTC)
From the debate, verifiable or not, this seems to be SoP like MacDonald's burger so if it somehow gets cited, it should go straight to RFD. Mglovesfun (talk) 16:27, 12 December 2011 (UTC)
When I was in AmeriCorps (many years ago), we regularly used Stihl chainsaws, and everyone just called them Stihls. There are a few examples in literature:
  • 2011, Raeanne Thayne, Blackberry Summer, p. 156:
    “It's been a few years, but I'm sure I can remember how to fire up the Stihl.” Her eyes widened with surprise. “You're far too busy, Riley. You don't have time to be cleaning up my yard.
  • 2004, David Guterson, Our Lady of the Forest, p. 105:
    Appelbaum had described an hour-long program to unfold in something called the Old Forest Fire Pit with tourists seated on split-log benches under a cedar-shake faux-mossy roof while Pete Schein showed them how to sharpen a Stihl or fell a tree using the dutchman. The tree would be held together with hinge pins, and Stihl would be advertising.
  • 1996, Rick Just, Keeping Private Idaho, p. 214:
    He stood there for a moment staring at the scene up river, then he shuffled around like some mechanical thing and stared at the tools hung over his workbench. He saw a line of screwdrivers stuck in pegboard, saws and clamps hung from hooks, the painted outline of a missing hammer, and pliers in their proper place. His favorite Stihl was sitting on the work top. Beneath the bench was the big McCulloch, just gathering dust.
In some of these, it is possible to surmise from reading the surrounding text more broadly that a Stihl is a kind of sawing device, although not necessarily a chainsaw. There are also a few references to caps bearing the Stihl logo as symbolizing the certain kind of person who would wear a cap bearing the logo of a chainsaw manufacturer:
  • 2009, Alex Stone, Hauling Checks, p. 35:
    I knew he was a lumberjack because he was wearing a Stihl hat and a red flannel shirt.
  • 2005, Thomas Sparrow, Northwoods Standoff, p. 259:
    "Sure you would, Peter," said the taller of the two, smirking and tugging on the greasy rounded brim of his Stihl cap.
  • 2004, Ana Maria Spagna, Now go home: wilderness, belonging, and the crosscut saw, p. :
    At what point can you bury the fact that you drove west in the sixties and traded your VW van for a can of Copenhagen and a Stihl ball cap?
I think that this collectively demonstrates that a certain culture exists within which "Stihl" is understood to mean a chainsaw, and would move this entry to Stihl. Of course, the word is also a surname, and should also get surname treatment. Cheers! bd2412 T 19:21, 18 January 2012 (UTC)
Moved per (my understanding of) this discussion. - -sche (discuss) 07:25, 25 March 2012 (UTC)


"(slang) A woman who frequents the gay scene usually with a male gay companion; often with chronically low self-esteem, superficially bolstered by attentive yet self-obsessed gays." Current definition seems offensive. I've heard of a fag hag but never this. Equinox 14:52, 18 December 2011 (UTC)

Have removed the bit after the semi-colon, I'll bet it's not attestable in that much detail. Anyway, let's get three cites first then debate the actual wording. Mglovesfun (talk) 16:09, 18 December 2011 (UTC)
RFV-failed for now. - -sche (discuss) 07:28, 25 March 2012 (UTC)