Appendix talk:Hungarian pronunciation assimilation

This appendix serves the following purposes:

1. Provide learners with ready examples of assimilation.
2. Instruct Hungarian IPA content providers with a ready reference of this phenomena.
3. Provide an easy checklist that Hungarian IPA entries are accurate (if this appendix is updated by bot).

Automation via Bot

1. Scan Hungarian page changes.
2. If an IPA entry is found, check for one of the assimilation pairs.
3. If found, add the term to this appendix.

döfve

I'm wondering if fv assimilates to a long v. (It's not discussed on this page.) I don't really think so. I say döfve differently than "dövve". Any other examples of f followed by v? Qorilla (talk) 16:24, 28 September 2014 (UTC)

I've found the following interesting information on p46 of Lanstyák István: A MAGYAR BESZÉLT NYELV SAJÁTOSSÁGAI:

"Rendhagyó módon viselkedik a v, amely alapvetően zörejhangnak minősül, mégis felemás módon vesz részt a zöngésségi hasonulásban: maga zöngétlenedik ugyan, de az előtte álló mássalhangzót a köznyelvben és a legtöbb nyelvjárásban nem zöngésíti.

tévtanítás [téftanítás], szívtől [szíftől], révkalauz [réfkalauz], évhez [éfhez],

de ötven [ötven], nem pedig *[ödven]"

So that explains that döfve is [döfve] and not *[dövve]. --Panda10 (talk) 17:20, 28 September 2014 (UTC)

-ndny-, -ndm-...

mindnyájan assimilates to miɲːaːjɒn. I'm wondering if it's the case in every nasal + (d or t) + nasal cluster. But it seems a bit ambiguous. What's up with mindmáig, I say it a bit contracted, but not fully like "mimmáig", but it also depends on speed. Other example: mindnél. Similar to minnél, but not fully. Is pontnál "ponnál"? This is a small peculiarity. Otherwise I can reproduce all effects in this page from my script. Qorilla (talk) 18:29, 28 September 2014 (UTC)

From the same document:

"Szóbelseji torlódások vagy idegen tőszavakban vannak jelen, vagy pedig magyar toldalékolt és összetett szavakban, ill. szókapcsolatokban. A t és a d különösen hajlamos a törlésre.

mindnyájan [miɲːaːjɒn]

majdnem [mɒjnɛm]

testsúly [tɛʃːuːj]"

As you said, it depends on speed. As for the other examples, I'd say mindmáig [minmaːʲig]. I agree: mindnél and pontnál there is a subtle stop after the first n, but the d and t are not fully pronounced. --Panda10 (talk) 18:48, 28 September 2014 (UTC)

-gys-

I (and Wikipedia) think that "egység" becomes /ˈɛt͡ʃːeːɡ/, just like ramatyság is /ˈrɒmɒt͡ʃːaːɡ/ and négyszer is /ˈneːt͡sːɛr/ etc. Why do you think that it's not so? Qorilla (talk) 18:38, 28 September 2014 (UTC)

From the same document:

lágyság [látyság] > [láccság]

irigység [iritység] > [iriccség]

nagyság [natyság] > [naccság]

hegység [hetység] > [heccség]

nem hagy sokat [haty sokat] > [hacs csokat]

I never pronounce it as /ˈɛt͡ʃːeːɡ/. If you look at the small table with the voiced and unvoiced pairs, you'll see that gy assimilates to ty. I think if the speach is very fast (and perhaps a little careless), it may sound as /ˈɛt͡ʃːeːɡ/, but if you want to pronounce it nicely, it is /ˈɛcʃeːɡ/. --Panda10 (talk) 19:01, 28 September 2014 (UTC)

Yeah, there is a continuum between the two extremes, depending on speed and formal vs. informal context. I'm fine with either in the entries. Qorilla (talk) 19:40, 28 September 2014 (UTC)