Talk:好人

RFV discussion: April 2020–December 2021

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好人

Rfv-sense: Beautiful woman. Not in any dictionaries I can access. ---> Tooironic (talk) 23:06, 14 April 2020 (UTC)

@Tooironic: You probably missed 教育部重編國語辭典修訂本 and 漢語大詞典, which both list 美人 as its first definition. The problem is that the quote from Shijing used to exemplify the definition is not always interpreted as such. Legge translates it as "a wealthy man". 漢語大詞典 has an additional quote, which seems to be clearer. @Frigoris, do you agree with these two dictionaries or Legge? — justin(r)leung _{{ (t...) | c=› }} 07:07, 23 November 2020 (UTC)

@Frigoris, not sure if you got the ping above, so I'm pinging you again. — justin(r)leung _{{ (t...) | c=› }} 17:01, 7 July 2021 (UTC)

@Justinrleung, hello, what is the thing with (presumably James) Legge? Is there a quotation? --Frigoris (talk) 17:55, 7 July 2021 (UTC)

@Frigoris: Sorry for not including the quote. It's from 《詩經·魏風·葛屨》：「要之襋之，好人服之。」 Both 教育部重編國語辭典修訂本 and 漢語大詞典 have included this under their definition of 美人, but Legge translate this line as "[His bride] puts the waistband to his lower garment and the collar to his upper, / And he, a wealthy man, wears them." — justin(r)leung _{{ (t...) | c=› }} 18:50, 7 July 2021 (UTC)

@Justinrleung, I think Legge was too deeply mired in the 毛詩 exegesis tradition, in this particular case, for our use in this dictionary. We can simply read it as "good human", referring to the beloved. --Frigoris (talk) 19:04, 7 July 2021 (UTC)

@Frigoris: Sorry for the late reply. So if it should just be interpreted as "good human", should "beautiful woman" be removed? Hanyu Da Cidian cites 馬瑞辰通釋：“好人猶言美人。” as a commentary on the Shijing passage mentioned above. 唐張鷟《遊仙窟》：“昨夜眼皮瞤，今朝見好人。” is also given in Hanyu Da Cidian as a use for the 美人 sense. — justin(r)leung _{{ (t...) | c=› }} 17:09, 11 August 2021 (UTC)

@Justinrleung, I just think the term itself doesn't imply a particular gendering; the Shijing verse probably was addressed to a male by a female, while in the Tang erotic story referring to female(s). I feel that the RFVSensed sense could be phrased as "a fair one; a good, beautiful, or dear person". --Frigoris (talk) 18:42, 11 August 2021 (UTC)

Added the two quotes mentioned above. Since this is a literary (non-Standard Written Chinese) term, this can be considered cited. — justin(r)leung _{{ (t...) | c=› }} 03:59, 10 December 2021 (UTC)

• RFV passed. — justin(r)leung _{{ (t...) | c=› }} 03:28, 19 December 2021 (UTC)