Talk:bruschetta

The plurals given are used in English, but I think this word is more often used as an uncountable noun (as in "Do you like bruschetta?"; "Can we have some more bruschetta?"). Comments/supporting evidence? -- Paul G 06:08, 27 Apr 2004 (UTC)

It's probably the same as with many other foods in English in being able to be used as both (try "pizza" in your example sentences) but it does in my experience seem to be primarily a mass noun (perhaps "uncountable" is a misleading synonym in this case?).

Also, the note that categorically states the pronunciation is one way and not another seems to lack NPOV... prescriptively it is /sk/ because of the etymology but I have heard /brʌˈʃɛdə/ from Italian restaurants and I think even TV commercials (tho I'm not entirely sure of that one). —Muke Tever 07:35, 27 Apr 2004 (UTC)

The makeshift pronunciation I have added is misleading. The 'u' is the sound in 'could' (ʊ) (or maybe even the neutral vowel /ə/) rather than the sound in 'cut' (/ʌ/).

(True. The pronunciation I cited was a little half-assed: my experience upholds /ə/.)

I agree that the pronunciation is non-NPOV. The Italian is certainly -sk-, no question. My view, as an Italian speaker, is that the -sh- in English comes from ignorance of Italian or comparison with the German "sch". In restaurants in the UK I have ordered bruschetta with a -sk- only to have the waiter repeat it back to me as bruschetta with a -sh-. I don't know which has greater prevalence, but agree that the the English pronunciation should be descriptive rather than prescriptively attempt to maintain something close to the original Italian.

In any case, I'll add the Italian pronunciation to the Italian entry. -- Paul G 08:46, 27 Apr 2004 (UTC)

I think both pronunciations are used, and probably should both be listed, with a usage note describing one as etymological and one as based on the spelling. —Muke Tever 09:12, 27 Apr 2004 (UTC)

That seems reasonable, even though a part of me wants to insist that everyone uses the "correct" one :) I had to smile when I read this, as the Italian pronunciation of the Italian word is based on its spelling, as is the case for all Italian words. Interestingly, a glance at my print dictionary suggests that -sch- is pronounced "sk" in most words beginning with sch- and "sh" in most words ending in it. -- Paul G

I hope I've found a good compromise in "The Merriam-Webster Dictionary lists the two common English pronunciations, of which only the first is accepted in Italian." (English Pronunciation note) I do think it's important to avoid prescriptivism when it's about subjective value judgements and not being aware of one's own POV, but then it is equally important to show respect for other languages (and by extention, other cultures) and I think it's pretty clear that this is one of those latter cases.--Tyranny Sue 04:27, 10 April 2009 (UTC)

I think you'll find that Italian spelling is based on Italian pronunciation. Few languages have a written form before a spoken form. I hope this was a thinko (: — 138.130.36.104 12:48, 27 Apr 2004 (UTC)