User talk:Dick Laurent/Archive 2006

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An invitation to beer parlor discussion.[edit]

Based on your entries so far, I thought you might be interested in a new topic for discussion at beer parlor called Wiktionary:Beer parlour#Wiktionary Romanization standards for Japanese. Please feel free to read and submit your opinions. A-cai 14:36, 18 August 2006 (UTC)

あくぎ et al[edit]

Why furigana? The entry is for the hiragana script form of a noun. Sure, it can be used as furigana, but so can any kana when it is desired to explicate the kanji. I changed the entry for あくぎ please look and tell me what you think. (Where did "japdef" come from? No other language is done that way here.) Robert Ullmann 15:14, 19 August 2006 (UTC)

I've been working on the structure of CJKV languages; there are a lot of things that were invented by people who thought that Chinese, or Mandarin, or Japanese, etc. just didn't fit the existing structure/style, and created a bunch of things that now need to be sorted out.
ALL entries in ALL languages should be ==(language)==, ===(part of speech)===, line with headword and forms, preferably templated (e.g. ja-noun), and the definitions in English. There are other standard headers, but these languages invented lots of additional ones, cause they "didn't fit". The POS categories e.g. Category:Japanese nouns shouls always be done by the templates. I'm just now sorting out ja-noun; it is good enough to use. Robert Ullmann 15:36, 19 August 2006 (UTC)
(yes), see my talk page; can we keep the conversation thread one place or the other? ;-) Robert Ullmann 15:48, 19 August 2006 (UTC)

Template:ja-noun[edit]

Hi, would be good if you would use the new template; somone is going to have to re-template all of the janoun entries. Besides, it will make your life easier: see かんせん and kansen, notice the entries are identical except for the script form parameter, and you don't in any case need to add Category tags. (The template does those, still to be tweaked a bit, but you don't need to worry about it.)

Might look a little strange to have the ja-noun template on a romaji entry with a redundant rom= parameter, but the template ignores it; it works that way on purpose.

And you don't need to (and shouldn't in general) wikilink parameters, the template does that.

re your comment on my talk page; yes, it may look a bit redundant in this cases; but there are a lot of pages in the wiktionary following a standard style, sometimes things look like they could be simpler, but introducing special structure in those cases actually makes everything more complex. These entries are, in fact, for six different words. Consider for example Quechua, look at the long list of ethnologue entries, surely a table would be better? Yes, for that entry and Mixtec and a few others, but then we have one more structure to maintain.

Some people would maintain that the ===Noun=== header should be repeated six times. And it probably should be ... but I'm not going there. Robert Ullmann 15:22, 20 August 2006 (UTC)

Somebody would have to clean it up; we have to have a consistant structure and style across all languages. ;-) Pity the poor person that doesn't understand squiggles like 感染, and is looking up the word "kansen". They don't know that the romaji can be for 6 different nouns: they don't know what "romaji" means. Without the separate templates (and, really, Noun headings) it looks just like one word with 6 different senses. And this person is a large part of the target audience of the English wiktionary: the person say in East Africa who is fluent in 6 languages, including a reasonable command of English, who knows nothing about Japanese. See? Unless you want to explain carefully with a note on each page that even though the entry is really six words, it is formatted as one word because you want it to look pretty. Too bad if it is confusing! (okay, I'm getting snarky here, I apologize!) Robert Ullmann 15:45, 20 August 2006 (UTC)

kansen as an example[edit]

Hi, I hope you don't think I've been ignoring you; I did listen, and I've been working with other people and looking for a style that will fit the structure, use standard(ized) templates to do the categorization, and accommodate the abbreviated style that the editors of WT:AJ 6 months ago, as well as yourself, prefer.

(Sorry, that was a long sentence.)

Please look at kansen and tell me what you think. It uses the POS header, the POS template, has no extra categorization, and no repetitions. If it was for more than one part of speech, there would need to be two of more POS sections. If someone wanted a fuller POS section for a given definition/use, it can be broken out.

Note that we have templates ja-noun, ja-verb, and ja-adj. And the latter two have parameters to do the correct sub-categorization for you. Best, Robert Ullmann 12:04, 26 August 2006 (UTC)

Template:zh-ts[edit]

A-cai made this little template, mostly for use in translations sections; I added it to disturb; tell me if you like it. It has the appropriate font-language magic within it, like zh-forms, so it will get the correct glyphs.

And I think the ja- templates are ready ... Robert Ullmann 12:56, 9 September 2006 (UTC)

記憶[edit]

Little things: J does come before M (Japanese before Mandarin...). The rs= parameter has to have a two digit stroke count (03) so that it will sort before 10, 11, etc. Cheers! Robert Ullmann 11:46, 10 September 2006 (UTC)

Voting[edit]

I would like to point out to anyone who hasn't voted yet that there are at least four votes going on at the moment that everyone has a vested interest in, 4 Checkusers, 2 Admins, 1 new logo and 1 boardmember, the more the merrier when it comes to these votes, especially the checkusers which requires 25 votes before anyone can be appointed, and the board vote which determines the course of Wikimedia! - TheDaveRoss 15:49, 12 September 2006 (UTC)

ja-kanjitab[edit]

FYI: template ja-kanji has been moved to ja-kanjitab. (we want to be able to move kanji to ja-kanji where it should be)

Please use spaces between the characters in the template! Robert Ullmann 16:31, 23 September 2006 (UTC)

It was moved. So right now {{ja-kanji}} is still a redirect to {{ja-kanjitab}}. That will change when {{kanji}} is moved to {{ja-kanji}} where it should be. Robert Ullmann 13:36, 24 September 2006 (UTC)

微笑[edit]

Hi, I'd like to let you know that I moved and edited two entries “ほほえ” and “hohoe” as the kun-yomi word that belongs to 微笑 is ほほえみ (微笑み). Cheers! --Tohru 01:05, 15 October 2006 (UTC)

zh-forms[edit]

The form on the page is wikilinked char-by-char, the other form is wikilinked together, so the link goes to the other form of the word. I know, picky. Robert Ullmann 00:13, 25 October 2006 (UTC)