Talk:mug shot
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The following discussion has been moved from Wiktionary:Requests for verification (permalink).
This discussion is no longer live and is left here as an archive. Please do not modify this conversation, but feel free to discuss its conclusions.
Sense 2. UK slang: "An unflattering photograph of a person's face." Never heard of this one. Equinox ◑ 23:26, 16 August 2023 (UTC)
- Not only does it sound familiar irl (though I can’t remember exactly when and where I’ve heard it) but I’ve now Cited it. --Overlordnat1 (talk) 00:39, 17 August 2023 (UTC)
- These cites aren't very convincing. The 2002 one ctalks of "mug-shot grins" when a police mug shot stereotypically has the subject adopting a neutral expression, so I can see that as perhaps supporting this semse, but the other three could easily fit sense 1; nothing in the cites gives us reason to think the photographs are "unflattering". This, that and the other (talk) 04:48, 17 August 2023 (UTC)
- Agreed, citations do not seem to support the sense at all. (By the way, "mug" can of course mean "gullible person" in British slang, but that doesn't automatically support this phrase as an idiom.) Equinox ◑ 12:20, 17 August 2023 (UTC)
- Of course they’re convincing - they all refer to photos taken in a Photo booth , or using the ‘Photo Booth’ app, not actual mugshots taken by a police photographer. --Overlordnat1 (talk) 13:02, 18 August 2023 (UTC)
- The citations support the fact that sense 1 doesn't restrict itself to always being taken by police. Maybe it would be worth having two senses along the lines of "A photograph taken of the head and shoulders, often from the front and in profile, taken by police, usually in conjunction with somebody's arrest." and "A photo of someone's face (and often shoulders) taken in other circumstances.", but the cites don't seem to support the RFV'd sense of an unflattering photo. - -sche (discuss) 19:49, 18 August 2023 (UTC)
- I’ve amended sense 2, so now resolved? I suppose sense 2 could be merged with sense 1 and the quotes moved over instead though if that’s what people prefer. --Overlordnat1 (talk) 08:44, 19 August 2023 (UTC)
- Sense 1 says "usually" so it's now just redundant. —Al-Muqanna المقنع (talk) 08:50, 19 August 2023 (UTC)
- It is really. I can see this going the way of the former unsinkable definition, where we say it’s used ‘usually of ships’ but the quotes refer to other objects. Similarly, we’ll be left with ‘usually taken in conjunction with someone’s arrest’ for this entry but with quotes relating to when it’s not used in conjunction with someone’s arrest. We should leave it another 3 weeks or so before failing it though to respect due process. Overlordnat1 (talk) 08:10, 25 August 2023 (UTC)
- Sense 1 says "usually" so it's now just redundant. —Al-Muqanna المقنع (talk) 08:50, 19 August 2023 (UTC)
- I’ve amended sense 2, so now resolved? I suppose sense 2 could be merged with sense 1 and the quotes moved over instead though if that’s what people prefer. --Overlordnat1 (talk) 08:44, 19 August 2023 (UTC)
- The citations support the fact that sense 1 doesn't restrict itself to always being taken by police. Maybe it would be worth having two senses along the lines of "A photograph taken of the head and shoulders, often from the front and in profile, taken by police, usually in conjunction with somebody's arrest." and "A photo of someone's face (and often shoulders) taken in other circumstances.", but the cites don't seem to support the RFV'd sense of an unflattering photo. - -sche (discuss) 19:49, 18 August 2023 (UTC)
RFV-resolved by remving sense 2 in favour of the better-worded sense 1. Overloadnat1 makes a good point about the citations. This is actually a common problem with {{rfv-sense}} requests; we only get quotes for the sense under challenge, while the more common senses remain uncited... This, that and the other (talk) 08:50, 27 November 2023 (UTC)