Template talk:fr-conj-é-er

jeter

Since discussing this via edit summaries isn't really working for me …

None of this will be news to you, but I'm writing it out so you see my thought process.

Before 1990, verbs like (deprecated template usage) lever and verbs like (deprecated template usage) jeter had their written stem changes in the same parts of the conjugation (specifically, everywhere where the next vowel was a silent-or-schwa <e>), while verbs like (deprecated template usage) espérer had their written stem changes in slightly different parts (specifically, everywhere where the entire ending was <e> or <es> or <ent>). In most people's speech, verbs like (deprecated template usage) espérer had their vowel changes in the same parts as verbs like (deprecated template usage) lever and verbs like (deprecated template usage) jeter; but this wasn't reflected in writing.

In 1990, the Academy recommended that verbs like (deprecated template usage) espérer have their written stem changes in the same parts of the conjugation as the spoken vowel changes, and therefore in the same parts of the conjugation as with verbs like (deprecated template usage) lever and verbs like (deprecated template usage) jeter.

At the same time, the Academy recommended that verbs like (deprecated template usage) jeter be conjugated instead like (deprecated template usage) acheter (i.e. like (deprecated template usage) lever), except for (deprecated template usage) jeter itself, and its derived forms, as well as (deprecated template usage) appeler and its derived form (deprecated template usage) rappeler. That recommendation isn't really relevant here, except insofar as it limits our examples (because something like “verbs like (deprecated template usage) ruisseler” would be ambiguous).

The reason I wrote “and also matching the conjugations of verbs like (deprecated template usage) lever and (deprecated template usage) jeter” was to indicate the two other conjugation patterns that match; replacing (deprecated template usage) jeter with (deprecated template usage) peler defeats this, since it's then giving two examples of one of the two other conjugation patterns that match.

—Ruakh_TALK 17:44, 20 August 2008 (UTC)

You are mistaken: (deprecated template usage) jeter was specifically amongst the verb that were exempted from the ette -> ète switch ("On ne fait exception que pour appeler (et rappeler) et jeter (et les verbes de sa famille), dont les formes sont les mieux stabilisées dans l’usage."). It's even explicitly stated in {{fr-conj-xx-er}}! As such, "jète" is and will remain incorrect, barring a drastic change in practices, and (deprecated template usage) lever or (deprecated template usage) amener will never conjugate like it. Circeus 19:18, 20 August 2008 (UTC)

I think you must have misread my comment? I explicitly said, “At the same time, the Academy recommended that verbs like (deprecated template usage) jeter be conjugated instead like (deprecated template usage) acheter (i.e. like (deprecated template usage) lever), except for (deprecated template usage) jeter itself, and its derived forms, as well as (deprecated template usage) appeler and its derived form (deprecated template usage) rappeler” (emphasis added). The point is that all these verbs have their stem changes in the exact same parts of the conjugation. —Ruakh_TALK 20:37, 20 August 2008 (UTC)

I still thoroughly disagree in drawing a parallel. Even though the changes are at the same place, so are those of (deprecated template usage) cueillir, and you wouldn't say it conjugate the same way. Circeus 22:45, 20 August 2008 (UTC)

Wait, what? The changes of (deprecated template usage) cueillir are in the infinitive, past participle, simple past, and past subjunctive. (Or, if you prefer: the changes of (deprecated template usage) cueillir are everywhere except in the infinitive, past participle, simple past, and past subjunctive.) The changes of (deprecated template usage) jeter, (deprecated template usage) lever, and (deprecated template usage) préférer are in certain parts of the present indicative, certain parts of the present subjunctive, certain parts of the present imperative, and all of the future and conditional. How are those "at the same place"? And anyway, I'm not saying they "conjugate the same way", just that they match in a certain way (specifically, that they match in the choice of forms that undergo the spelling change). —Ruakh_TALK 23:42, 20 August 2008 (UTC)

Update

This should use {{fr-conj}}, currently it's a separate template. Mglovesfun (talk) 19:32, 10 April 2010 (UTC)