Talk:भवामि

Categorization

@JainismWikipedian: This level of categorization is unnecessary and should definitely not be done manually. —Aryaman^{A (मुझसे बात करें • योगदान)} 21:20, 10 October 2018 (UTC)

I'm creating this level of categorization for all kinds of Sanskrit words. Undoubtedly it will be a monumental project but will be extremely useful for future. For instance, some new learner only wants to know the words he should speak based on first-person, then he can easily refer relevant category. Keep the categories as it is as of now. If some modules is developed to add such categories automatically, then for new words not yet created, automation can be used. --JainismWikipedian (talk) 21:45, 10 October 2018 (UTC)

@JainismWikipedian: All the first-person singular verbs end in -āmi so it's not really useful for learners to have this category. Also, why should only Sanskrit use this system? I think this project doesn't make sense unless it is for every language on Wiktionary. You should make a discussion on WT:BP if you want to pursue it. Anyway, I don't see the use of such categories being added manually, you are wasting your time and energy since if we do decide to do this, it will all be automated. —Aryaman^{A (मुझसे बात करें • योगदान)} 22:40, 10 October 2018 (UTC)

The simple "Aami" ending is only for first-person singular parasmaipada verbs in active voice in present tense. What my project envisions is that every word of Sanskrit will be categorized into their forms, so even if someone with basic knowledge of Sanskrit doesn't remember any ending, he can still build his vocabulary easily. And this categorization is not restricted to verbs. I've added it for some nouns, adjectives, and pronouns as of now. And I don't know about other languages, but since Sanskrit is an ancient language, there is no such project existing currently. So this is one of its kind. And also for majority of languages, there is single word to convey different moods and aspects irrespective of gender or person or voice. JainismWikipedian (talk) 22:48, 10 October 2018 (UTC)

• @JainismWikipedian, I'm going to step in here as an uninvolved admin. First of all, Aryaman reverted your changes and gave you an explanation. You need to stop reverting back and edit warring with him until the discussion has concluded. Secondly, Aryaman is right that this is not useful for learners, and the fact that we don't categorise verb forms this way in Sanskrit is not because Sanskrit is ancient, but because we don't do it this way for any other languages either. If it were desirable, we certainly wouldn't do it with bare categories (we would use the template on the definition line to categorise). If you think that learners or dictionary users really could benefit from it, Aryaman suggested a forum in which you can propose that, but creating a wholly different system for Sanskrit alone, let alone a system as unsustainable as this, is not a good idea. —Μετάknowledge^{discuss/deeds} 23:39, 10 October 2018 (UTC)

  Adding on to that, "for majority of languages, there is single word to convey different moods and aspects irrespective of gender or person or voice" is complete false. Latin is a very well-developed language on Wiktionary and it has an inflectional system rivalling Sanskrit. No categorization system is used for Latin, but I have seen many learners (such as students in Latin class at my school) benefit from the current organization of Latin entries. There is no discrimination against Sanskrit happening here and Sanskrit is not a special case that it deserves its own unique system of categories. —Aryaman^{A (मुझसे बात करें • योगदान)} 00:14, 11 October 2018 (UTC)

  And anyways, I don't think Wiktionary is suitable as a standalone resource for learning a language, and so I doubt it will be used by learners to memorize verb endings. That's more in the realm of flashcard apps and websites. This is first and foremost a dictionary. —Aryaman^{A (मुझसे बात करें • योगदान)} 00:15, 11 October 2018 (UTC)

• I've suggested my idea on the forum. I didn't say that there was discrimination happening against Sanskrit. My contention is that Sanskrit will have millions of non-lemma terms. To categorize them simply based on part of speech isn't useful at all. We need to further categorize these non-lemma based on tense, voice, person, etc. so that it becomes easier to refer to a particular category if one wants to write some Sanskrit article. Organization is always beneficial. And this idea is not at all unsustainable. Sanskrit language is a work in progress on Wiktionary; and there are hardly any non-lemma terms of Sanskrit language yet created. So, there's no question of this idea being unsustainable. Moreover, Wiktionary is not just a list of words; it has rhymes, appendixes, categorization, phrasebook, and so much more. So to learn a language from Wiktionary, is not an absurd idea. And, having such categories will be helpful only. It won't be reducing knowledge. JainismWikipedian (talk) 00:33, 11 October 2018 (UTC)

  @JainismWikipedian: I don't think I completely clarified my position in this matter. I would be fine with some degree of categorization as long as it is automatic, not manually as you are doing. —Aryaman^{A (मुझसे बात करें • योगदान)} 01:15, 12 October 2018 (UTC)