Talk:խօզ

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Latest comment: 5 years ago by Calak
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@Vahagn Petrosyan: Compare Persian خزه (xaze, moss), Northern Kurdish kevz and Central Kurdish قەوزە (qewze, algae).--Calak (talk) 20:20, 5 August 2018 (UTC)Reply

@Calak, excellent! I am sure these are all related. I wonder how no one noticed this so far. --Vahag (talk) 14:52, 6 August 2018 (UTC)Reply
Well, it’s easy to be wise after the event!--Calak (talk) 15:41, 6 August 2018 (UTC)Reply
That's true. Perhaps also the Persian word is uncommon. --Vahag (talk) 17:30, 6 August 2018 (UTC)Reply
This word (and its alt xawz) reminds me kōšik (and its alt kawšik). They have same development. --Calak (talk) 22:26, 6 August 2018 (UTC)Reply
Yes, Armenian օ (ō) developed regularly from աւ (aw), That is a well-known sound change. --Vahag (talk) 22:39, 6 August 2018 (UTC)Reply
We should find etymology of these Iranian words. Based on Armenian words, someone can suggest MIr. *xafs(ak) (with common x- > k- and fs > v/wz developments in Kurdish).--Calak (talk) 23:12, 6 August 2018 (UTC)Reply
That's above my paygrade :) --Vahag (talk) 14:04, 7 August 2018 (UTC)Reply

I think it can be related to Zazaki hewz (green) (PIr. *x- > NP x-, Kurd k-, Zaza h-).--Calak (talk) 22:56, 17 August 2018 (UTC)Reply

I added the Zazaki parallel but I don't know the sound laws of Iranian and can't comment. --Vahag (talk) 11:04, 18 August 2018 (UTC)Reply
An example to clarify: Avestan xara-, MP xar, NP xar, Kurdish ker, Zazaki her (all mean "donkey").--Calak (talk) 11:15, 18 August 2018 (UTC)Reply

The relationship between these words is discussed in Husein Muhammed Rehnas. Ferhenga etîmolojî ya kurdî s.v. kesk, but without the Armenian. --Vahag (talk) 11:48, 18 August 2018 (UTC)Reply

I read it, it is wrong etymology. He derives Kurdish kesk form kevz + -k! That is impossible. These are two separate words. kesk is cognate with MP. kaskēn (from kask + ēn).--Calak (talk) 11:58, 18 August 2018 (UTC)Reply

@Vahagn Petrosyan: I think I found etymology of this word. It is cognate with Ossetian хӕфс (xæfs, frog), metathesis of OIr. kasyapa-. Now we should clear relation of frog and moss, algae. Asatrian says Persian words for moss, algae are a compound, from frog + clothes/carpet; comapre Persian جل وزغ, جلبک from جل (clothes) + وزغ (toad), بک (frog). I also add Persian چغزواره from چغز (frog) + -واره (to cover). So Armenian xawz and Iranian cognates actually are a part of a compound (like Kermanic baža).--Calak (talk) 11:51, 23 August 2018 (UTC)Reply

@Calak: this is very promising. Compare also Armenian գորտնբուրդ (gortnburd, algae, literally frog-wool), գորտնխալի (gortnxali, algae, literally frog-carpet). I will definitely return to this and expand the entry in a few weeks. I am very busy right now. --Vahag (talk) 21:06, 25 August 2018 (UTC)Reply
@Calak: I have added the etymology proposed by you. Can you add the transliterations and glosses to the Persian and Kermanic forms? --Vahag (talk) 11:20, 8 December 2018 (UTC)Reply
Done.--Calak (talk) 10:56, 22 December 2018 (UTC)Reply