Talk:noonflower

RFV discussion: January–February 2023

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noonflower

The form in Webster is noon-flower (hyphenated). The meaning of goat's-beard intended in the definition is Tragopogon. I can also find other sources defining this term as Mesembryanthemum, Carpobrotus, Ipomoea, Disphyma, and I'm not sure that list is even complete. I'm mostly just finding mentions for all of these, though. 70.172.194.25 21:02, 8 January 2023 (UTC)

I have several uses of noonflower in running text, so we almost certainly need an entry. There are many other cases in which the term appears, 1., in apposition to one of several taxonomic names or, 2., in a tabular presentation of various predicates of the organism named by a taxon. I don't think that either of these constitute mentions, any more than a toponym appearing on a map is thereby merely mentioned. These would certainly be necessary to provide definitions that specified taxa, which, I think, should be the point of this kind of entry. DCDuring (talk) 23:41, 8 January 2023 (UTC)

I don't think e.g. a table that has a taxonomic name in one column and a common name in another column should count toward attestation, because that doesn't convey meaning (a specific requirement in the CFI policy). It's no better than saying "Tragopogon is sometimes known as "noonflower"", or a dictionary definition of "noonflower, n. a plant of the genus Tragopogon". I trust that you agree neither of those should count toward attestation, so how is this any different?

A sentence like "Noonflower (Tragopogon) commonly grows in XYZ environments" would be okay. 70.172.194.25 23:58, 8 January 2023 (UTC)

Those would be as scarce as hens' teeth. DCDuring (talk) 01:23, 9 January 2023 (UTC)

I'm not going to chase after any attestation more for this. DCDuring (talk) 01:24, 9 January 2023 (UTC)

Looks to be  cited. Ioaxxere (talk) 23:15, 9 February 2023 (UTC)

The entry currently has no citations, and most quotes at Citations:noonflower (created by DCDuring) seem to refer to Carpobrotus (or some other plants) rather than Tragopogon (which is the only sense that we have). – Einstein2 (talk) 18:42, 11 February 2023 (UTC)

According to Wikipedia [1] there are at least five different types of "noon flowers"... I'm tempted to pass this as an rfdef. Ioaxxere (talk) 02:56, 12 February 2023 (UTC)

RFV Passed, this term clearly exists but it's not clear which species the journal quotations are referring to. Ioaxxere (talk) 18:51, 20 February 2023 (UTC)