Wiktionary incorrectly classifies yeast
Webster's New World Dictionary, College Edition classifies yeast from M.E. yest, A.S. gist akin to German gischt O.H.G. jesan I.E. base jes, to foam boil up also in Greekzeein to boil. So it should say gist and not giest. But even when you click on gist, it shows yeast, but again on the top part of that article, it is wrong again. Wondering why(18.104.22.168 19:24, 4 May 2014 (UTC))
- Leaving aside for the moment the issue of gist vs. giest, you seem to be confused about how Wiktionary entries work: each entry contains information on every word in every language that's spelled the same. The page is split up into sections by language, with English (if it has a term with that spelling) always being the first section, then the sections for all the other languages are arranged after it in alphabetical order by language name. In the entry for gist, there's no Old English entry, and "yeast" is only in the Dutch section, because "gist" means "yeast" in Dutch. If you scroll to the top, you're going from the Dutch section to the English section (we treat Old English as a separate language, so the English section covers only Modern English), and "gist" doesn't mean "yeast" in modern English. In the giest entry, the Old English section is split into two etymologies. Because they're separate, nothing in Etymology 1 applies to Etymology 2. Etymology 2 is the one that has the definition applying to yeast, but you were lookng at Etymology 1.
- So, to sum it all up: there's nothing wrong with the gist or the giest, entries unless we're wrong about whether giest is a word for yeast in Old English. I suspect that it isn't, but I'm going to have to check further. Chuck Entz (talk) 23:56, 4 May 2014 (UTC)
- You are right, it t does not make much sense (to me) to link completely different word in different languages together, just because they happen to have similar spelling. To the supposed spelling giest, I have in front of me Webster's New World Dictionary and for yeast it states, as I wrote earlier: "yeast M.E. yest, A.S. gist akin to German gischt, spray, froth & O.H.G. jesan to ferment. I.E. base jes-, to foam, boil up, seen also in Gr. zeein, to boil (cf.ECZEMA<ENZYME " then description of yeast. It DOES NOT say A.S. giest. Matthias Lexers" Middle High German book tells me under g gis - schaum; gischen- schäumen (also schluchsen) and under j jesen, gesen - - gären, schäumen; jest - gischt, schaum; gisten - schäumen Both, the English-language dictionary Webster's and the M.H.G. German-language Matthias Lexers DO NOT show GIEST spelling . Why does wiktionary repeatedly (falsely) state, that yeast was earlier spelled giest (meaning stranger? Wondering(22.214.171.124 01:28, 5 May 2014 (UTC))
- The OED says: "Old English (late West Saxon) gist, Anglian *gest, corresponding to Middle Low German gest dregs, dirt, Middle Dutch ghist, Dutch gist, gest yeast, Middle High German jest, gest, gist (German gischt, gäscht) yeast, froth, Old Norse jastr yeast, related to Old High German jeasan, gesan (Middle High German jesen, gesen, gern, German gähren to ferment), the causative Old High German jerian, gerian to cause to ferment, and Old Norse gerð yeast. The underlying base jes- is found also in Sanskrit yás(y)ati to seethe, boil, práyastas bubbling over, Avestan yah- to boil (intransitive), Albanian ǵeš buken I knead bread, Greek ζέω I boil, ζεστός boiled, Welsh iās seething". There is no mention of giest. I wonder where CodeCat and Chuck's other dictionaries found it? I suspect that it needs a rare tag, and delinking from yeast in modern English. Dbfirs 18:08, 12 May 2014 (UTC)
- You are right, giest needs to be delinked from yeast. Yeast earlier linked to the (unattested) spelling giest, Someone corrected that in the meanwhile. No source at all shows up at google search for "yeast giest", whereas yeast gist search results in over 2 thousand.MfG (126.96.36.199 00:08, 14 May 2014 (UTC))