Talk:ahıl
Latest comment: 3 years ago by Fay Freak
@Allahverdi Verdizade, I believe Arabic أهل is a better fit. See the Ottoman cognate: [1], [2]. --Vahag (talk) 18:56, 12 September 2021 (UTC)
- @Vahagn Petrosyan 'wife' -> 'old woman' -> 'old in general'? Allahverdi Verdizade (talk) 19:01, 12 September 2021 (UTC)
- @Allahverdi Verdizade: I was thinking "settled" > "domesticated, possessed with a family" > "not young and wild anymore". --Vahag (talk) 19:42, 12 September 2021 (UTC)
- The only problem is that all of that corresponds to Azerbaijani əhl and Turkish ehli (“tame”). The short Arabic /a/ is normally rendered by <ə> in Azerbaijani. The Persian cognate of the Arabic term I put in as the etymon, on the other hand, has the sense 'a woman in want of a husband', which is in line for the semantic shift scheme above. Also, the tendency to shift the senses between the concepts 'old woman' and 'wife', as in Turkish karı and Azerbaijani arvad. And the (anecdotal) evidence that is provided by the fact that ahıl qadınlar 'aging women' yields twice the amount of hits of ahıl kişilər 'aging men'. Allahverdi Verdizade (talk) 20:13, 12 September 2021 (UTC)
{{R:tr:OTK|page=152a|vol=I}}derives from Arabic āhil "settled". @Fay Freak, is there an Arabic word of that shape? --Vahag (talk) 08:57, 13 September 2021 (UTC)- @Vahagn Petrosyan: There is (آهِل (ʔāhil) written), but it hardly has this sense of “settled”, but “settled” in the sense of “there is people living there (أَهْل (ʔahl)”. Fay Freak (talk) 09:04, 13 September 2021 (UTC)
- The only problem is that all of that corresponds to Azerbaijani əhl and Turkish ehli (“tame”). The short Arabic /a/ is normally rendered by <ə> in Azerbaijani. The Persian cognate of the Arabic term I put in as the etymon, on the other hand, has the sense 'a woman in want of a husband', which is in line for the semantic shift scheme above. Also, the tendency to shift the senses between the concepts 'old woman' and 'wife', as in Turkish karı and Azerbaijani arvad. And the (anecdotal) evidence that is provided by the fact that ahıl qadınlar 'aging women' yields twice the amount of hits of ahıl kişilər 'aging men'. Allahverdi Verdizade (talk) 20:13, 12 September 2021 (UTC)
- @Allahverdi Verdizade: I was thinking "settled" > "domesticated, possessed with a family" > "not young and wild anymore". --Vahag (talk) 19:42, 12 September 2021 (UTC)