Talk:aandienen
Latest comment: 5 years ago by Mnemosientje in topic RFV discussion: February–March 2019
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Dutch, Rfv-sense of "(reflexive) to be expected, be anticipated". I suspect this is misinterpretation of the third sense. ←₰-→ Lingo Bingo Dingo (talk) 11:35, 4 February 2019 (UTC)
- Indeed, the usex for sense 2 actually fits the third sense much better. I think the translation is seriously off, though. And doesn’t the reflexive sense 3 actually mean, more precisely, “to present oneself”? – at least, I think a clause like “indien de gelegenheid zich aandient” corresponds to English ”if the opportunity presents itself”, whereas “to arrive” corresponds more closely to zich voordoen (sense 2). --Lambiam 15:53, 4 February 2019 (UTC)
- @Lambiam I would say that is just another way of appearing or arising. It can be used of people physically arriving at a place, but that does seem less common, so I have rearranged/modified the translations in sense 3.
←₰-→Lingo Bingo Dingo (talk) 08:46, 5 February 2019 (UTC)- I think the original non-reflexive meaning, now perhaps somewhat archaic, is to announce someone’s arrival (see the 19th-century uses here). The common current reflexive meaning may have been mediated by pseudo-reflexive uses like “zich laten aandienen”. Do you agree that the usex for sense 2 has a better fit at sense 3 and that its translation is wrong? --Lambiam 09:44, 5 February 2019 (UTC)
- @Lambiam Yes, that looks like a plausible development. And I agree about the usex, which isn't very good for several reasons, the translation "successors" in particular makes no sense. I would assume antecedent means "previous/earlier fact/doing/deed", but it could also mean "symptom in/from one's medical history" and the context is anything but helpful.
←₰-→Lingo Bingo Dingo (talk) 09:56, 5 February 2019 (UTC)- I’ve moved the usex to sense 3 and corrected the translation. The sentence is copied from a dialogue in one of the Baantjer books, De Cock en de broeders van de haat. In the context (an explanation of why the murder victim, an evangelist, had trouble finding reliable people) de antecedenten onderzoeken clearly means to perform a background check. --Lambiam 22:36, 5 February 2019 (UTC)
- @Lambiam Yes, that looks like a plausible development. And I agree about the usex, which isn't very good for several reasons, the translation "successors" in particular makes no sense. I would assume antecedent means "previous/earlier fact/doing/deed", but it could also mean "symptom in/from one's medical history" and the context is anything but helpful.
- I think the original non-reflexive meaning, now perhaps somewhat archaic, is to announce someone’s arrival (see the 19th-century uses here). The common current reflexive meaning may have been mediated by pseudo-reflexive uses like “zich laten aandienen”. Do you agree that the usex for sense 2 has a better fit at sense 3 and that its translation is wrong? --Lambiam 09:44, 5 February 2019 (UTC)
- @Lambiam I would say that is just another way of appearing or arising. It can be used of people physically arriving at a place, but that does seem less common, so I have rearranged/modified the translations in sense 3.
- RFV failed — Mnemosientje (t · c) 11:29, 14 March 2019 (UTC)