Talk:فعل

'فِعْل m ‎(plural أَفَاعِيل ) exploit, great deed, feat'

I'd like to know why its being a verbal noun is not specified in its section. Thank you in advance. --Backinstadiums (talk) 18:51, 30 January 2017 (UTC)

فَعَّال

Hi, I'd like to add the meaning of فَعَّال 'effective', yet I do not know whether it's an adjective or a form related to the second form فَعَّل. — This unsigned comment was added by Backinstadiums (talk • contribs) at 16:49, 13 February 2017 (UTC).

@Backinstadiums: فَعَّال (faʕʕāl) is a pattern associated with occupational nouns and characteristic adjectives. Since the consonant doubling is part of the pattern, it doesn't indicate a connection to Form II. The meaning relates to the root, and often is similar to the meaning of the form-I verb, if I recall right: someone who does the action of the verb habitually, or as an occupation. — Eru·tuon 01:19, 14 February 2017 (UTC)

Yes, correct. Habitual or occupational doing, generally with regard to the meaning of the I. stem. (In the sense that fa‘‘âl is an intensive form and the II. stem is sometimes intensive as well one might see a relation between them, but this would only be relevant in a minority of cases.) 2.203.201.61 20:55, 12 August 2019 (UTC)

About removing my hard work edit of verb فعل needed to know information

reply to user:Fay Freak please don't remove this information backed by al-Farahidi circa 750 AD and other Arabic grammerticians. I will add references. The information you deleted are not misplaced but this is its perfect place, Fairly understood ( you can edit it for better English if you want). I see you are trailing me for some reason. Wiktionary and wikis require sources and I provide them. My removed contribution: "It is the root verb similar to "do" used in the grammar cliche "فَعَلَ يَفْعَلُ فهو فاعِل و فَعّال

و فُعَيْل و أَفْعَل الخ والمصدر فِعْل. 

فعل فَعَّلَ فُعِلَ فَعُلَ" to derive other words such as nouns adjectives actions, and intimately derives verbs such as done, and to make the several cliches of Arabic poetry such as " فعولن مفاعيلن..." so to check the quality of any given poem verses, and to check on words to see if they are Arabic in origin, since all words in Arabic derive from a given verb, and a word can not exist before its root verb. That any word in Arabic language has to derive from a verb according to the grammaretically made formula using this verb. It is pronounced as Fa3ala where 3 is the letter 'Ayn ع pronounced 3yn. Where all the root words have to be vocalized ( ie hidden in written vocals) the same way ie three A after every consonant letter of فعل. Zahida2013 (talk) 23:28, 17 October 2023 (UTC)

@Zahida2013: The issue is that you should find a place in accordance with Wiktionary’s strict formatting rules (WT:EL), and at some point people not have to clean up after you. I only trail because you are new and there are a lot of things to learn for you, somebody has to trail you—that’s the issue. Fay Freak (talk) 23:31, 17 October 2023 (UTC)

thank you, but you have already twice insulted me. I will seek assistance from other editors willing to help. I don't have time to read all the wikis formulas. But for the interested people the information I provide would be helpful. You can then volunteer to formulate my edits instead of removing them wholesale! Zahida2013 (talk) 00:02, 18 October 2023 (UTC)

I second what @Fay Freak said. The message posted by @Zahida2013 looks like online chat. For starters, we use فَعَلَ (faʕala) not "Fa3ala". Anatoli T. ^{(обсудить}/^вклад) 00:08, 18 October 2023 (UTC)

Wiktionary:About Arabic has some guidance about Arabic vocalisations and transliterations. Making it readable for wider audience is also important, the entry sections should be appropriately ordered and formatted. Anatoli T. ^{(обсудить}/^вклад) 00:12, 18 October 2023 (UTC)

if you or someone you know is willing to volunteer helping me with formulations, that would be great and appreciated.

To read and muster all the wikis formulations can take a full time job, such time not available to me. Finding sources consumes most of my allotted time. Zahida2013 (talk) 00:24, 18 October 2023 (UTC)

@Zahida2013: It's more work formulating and fixing your edits. The functions of root letter patterns are explained better elsewhere. I don't find your edits valuable, the way you phrased it, even regardless of the format. I'll have to block you from editing this page, if you don't stop.

Also calling @Fenakhay. Please check the edits by Zahida2013. Anatoli T. ^{(обсудить}/^вклад) 00:34, 18 October 2023 (UTC)

The instructions for editing in Wiktionary don't require the special formulations as they stated.

I did not call user:Fenakhay ?

I am reporting that this verb فعل is special in being the master word used in formulations in the Arabic language as mentioned first by Farahidi circa 750 Ad and expounded later by the Lexicon grammartician al-Farra. Why these information are not to be mentioned here , Is it because it is against POV of some persons? I had it referenced. My edit contribution is readable and it is very helpful to people interested in Arabic language! Where is it mentioned somewhere else on Wikipedia considering it's vital information Zahida2013 (talk) 18:07, 18 October 2023 (UTC)

@Zahida2013: Your additions are encyclopaedic and have no place in a dictionary. Get familiar yourself with WT:EL, WT:CFI and WT:About Arabic. — Fenakhay ^{(حيطي · مساهماتي)} 18:11, 18 October 2023 (UTC)

Sorry I replied to you thinking I was replying to Fay Freak.

I will try one last time to add shorter edit about فعل being the master word used in grammer. It is of Note that this verb meaning "do" is the conventionally generic root verb of all other verbs..

Can you lead me where in wikis I can add this information? Zahida2013 (talk) 18:31, 18 October 2023 (UTC)

@Zahida2013: Possibly in a section Usage notes, allowed under WT:EL. But this would only be one sentence about it being a kind of placeholder, more likely on page ف ع ل (f-ʕ-l), which even we don’t know how to formulate. If we don’t know how, you won’t make it better either. Please just don’t. Somebody else will do it some day. You have a long life yet and will see it. Concentrate on the things you know, and what you still have to learn, not on pushing something that people demonstratedly won’t agree with. You should read more English novels for example. And Western works on linguistics. Your facility in extracting vocabulary is great, but conceptually there is a lot to catch up for you. Be studious and come back in four years, before trying to teach things to people. Really with ten years I shouldn’t have edited Wikis, in hindsight: quite different with fourteen. Fay Freak (talk) 22:12, 18 October 2023 (UTC)

About me calling user:Fenakhay. Apology! It was a mistake I replied to him while I thought I was replying to user:Fay Freak who insulted me twice in here. Zahida2013 (talk) 18:27, 18 October 2023 (UTC)

You don’t even know what an insult is. If I tried to insult you, you would be so shocked and awestruck as to not come back to this place for months. But scolding you is apt. Fay Freak (talk) 22:12, 18 October 2023 (UTC)

You called my Arabic of 10 years old and that my English is bad. In Your reverts you asked that if it was an error to contact you on your talk page. I would appreciate if you re matriculate my edits instead of removing them. I would appreciate the help in my future edits. I have difficulty formatting new entries. So I am going to use the simplest format allowed in Wiktionary. Zahida2013 (talk) 23:07, 18 October 2023 (UTC)

@Zahida2013: I considered you ten years old (born 2013!), and there is no insult here. It is difficult to communicate such an adult thing as making a dictionary adults will read with the additional cultural difference. Even most adults don’t know what to do here. Your translations into English actually weren’t bad, but the stuff you “tried to explain” was incomprehensible. Plus, are you even using the preview function? Why not? You started قنأ “to increase on it”, which is strange English (natives say: “to expand it”), and didn’t put the derived terms (only derived terms should be the header, not derivatives!) in {{l}}, as they should be. You also have to use header templates such as {{ar-verb}} and {{ar-noun}}, and you can also add inflections with {{ar-conj}} and {{ar-decl-noun}}: Just look how other pages are coded. Fay Freak (talk) 23:30, 18 October 2023 (UTC)

how can I find a helper in short time? so I could expand on adjectives and examples.

I use preview and it tells mistake or show nothing but Arabic. Zahida2013 (talk) 23:40, 18 October 2023 (UTC)

@Zahida2013: First it is a good idea to use our category system and find some similar entries, the formatting of which you could copy. If you prefix Template: in the search function, you might also find all templates you need—or you look into Category:Arabic templates. You see why we have to use header templates: So entries get categorized into Category:Arabic lemmas and further. (But please don’t change templates or categories yet, first you need to be sure how to make correctly formatted pages.)

The preview shows you how the page will look after your having saved it. It will also say error if there would be an error, and broken links etc. (like when you use templates that don’t exist. Fay Freak (talk) 23:48, 18 October 2023 (UTC)

I am old to learn new things such as the maze of Wiktionary formulations and I have to write fast. I am interested to connect entries.

Thanx Zahida2013 (talk) 00:02, 19 October 2023 (UTC)

@Zahida2013: Your interests, hobbies, even passion, are not sufficient to make or edit entries. We can now afford to keep entries in good quality and follow some standards. The information you tried to provide may be important, but irrelevant and misplaced.

We also have various appendices for additional information, e.g. Appendix:Arabic verbs. Some take a lot of thought and efforts and multiple users are involved and they keep up with changing templates, modules and standard. You just arrived and already trying to push something people dislike. Anatoli T. ^{(обсудить}/^вклад) 00:17, 19 October 2023 (UTC)

Dislike? Not all people are the same. Some people might find my info interesting. After all, I am providing references and historical examples to back up my edits. Can you point to a dislikable part? I am expert in Arabic and been in us for 40 years and got degrees so my English should be good I guess. I have spasms and sight problem prevent me from looking at screen too much. Zahida2013 (talk) 00:48, 19 October 2023 (UTC)

I've been editing wiki since 2012.

If I master editing formulations and excel in English, I probably didn't have time to gain knowledge or seek knowledge. Zahida2013 (talk) 01:07, 19 October 2023 (UTC)

@Zahida2013 No, noone will find it any useful.

• You show similar attitude in wiki too, you keep saying how you have provided Sources and your unwillingness to accept anything.
• Even after being 40+ year old, you feel insulted when just said to be wrong.
• No you are not an expert in Arabic
• You need to learn yourself how to edit without crying for a helper

As Fay Freak says: Be studious and come back in four years, instead of reading your heart-comforting islamist scientific papers[1]. And please don't write more justifications. कालमैत्री (talk) 06:48, 19 October 2023 (UTC)

There is nothing in wiki about only adding data that other editors agree on. This is like making alternative reality to appease the editors cabal, not the truth mentioned by good references. I was trying to add grammar info about the verb, and that فعل is the verb ( obviously because of its meaning " do" ) that is used as master word to formulate derivatives of nouns and adjectives.

This kind of info is a dictionary information not encyclopedic. Zahida2013 (talk) 18:15, 19 October 2023 (UTC)

كم من لئيم مشى بالزور ينقله

لا يتقي الله لا يخشى من العار

يود لو أنه للمرء يهلكه

ولم ينله سوى إثم وأوزار

فإن سمعت كلامًا فيك جاوزه

وخل قائله في غيه ساري

فما تبالي السما يومًا إذا نبحت

كل الكلاب وحق الواحد الباري

وقد وقعت ببيت نظمه درر

قد صاغه حاذق في نظمه داري

لو كل كلب عوى ألقمته حجرًا

لأصبح الصخر مثقالاً بدينار Zahida2013 (talk) 02:18, 20 October 2023 (UTC)