Talk:ܙܪܢܦܐ

@Wikitiki89: Hi. Could you add a transliteration here (it's transliterated as zarnāp̄ā at Arabic زرافة, but I don't know what it's worth), and maybe create an entry for ܙܵܪܝܼܦܵܐ (apparently variously transliterated as zārīp̄ā - when unpointed? - and zarāfa - when pointed?)?

Also, would you know which is the direct source of the Arabic? Unless our entry for Hebrew ג׳ירפה is right in saying the Arabic is either from Persian, either from Syriac (which is then left unetymologised)...

And Faroese giraffur says the word did not go straight from Syriac to Arabic, but went through Somali (geri). Our entries are quite inconsistent. Per utramque cavernam 11:56, 7 January 2019 (UTC)

The Syriac fits for the form. /n/ appearing and disappearing close to an other consonant is typical for Aramaic, so Classical Syriac ܙܪܢܦܐ (zarnāp̄ā) becomes Classical Syriac ܙܪܝܦܐ‎ (zārīp̄ā), and likely there was Classical Syriac ܙܪܦܐ (*zarāp̄ā).

The Faroese just raised eyebrows since it is not so easily from Cushitic. Somali geri would not come out Arabic زَرَافَة (zarāfa), and I don’t know of any borrowings of Arabic from Cushitic even for animal names, and here the (historical) distribution of the camelopard (that was all up to the North of Africa) suggests a borrowing way earlier than Arabs going into Somalia. Even if it is from Cushitic then it came via Ethiosemitic.

I would ask about this “unknown Egyptian word” sor-aphé “long-neck” mentioned in Kluge and thus German Wiktionary, which is also pointed to as Egyptian ser “hoch, groß” by Hommel. @Vorziblix Fay Freak (talk) 15:41, 7 January 2019 (UTC)

@Fay Freak: The supposed Egyptian sor-aphé ‘long-neck’ is apparently Coptic ⲥⲱⲣ (sōr, “to spread”) + ⲁⲡⲉ (ape, “head”) (Bohairic variant ⲁⲫⲉ (aphe)). Needless to say, positing these two words together as meaning ‘long-neck’ or ‘giraffe’ is badly outdated 19th century scholarship. (Sorry for the late reply; I’ve had a lot of real-life things going on and had no time to research until now.) — Vorziblix (talk · contribs) 17:18, 26 January 2019 (UTC)

{{R:ar:Qamus|page=771|vol=II}} derives Arabic زُرَافَة (zurāfa) from زرف (“to increase”), because giraffe's neck is so long. --Vahag (talk) 16:39, 7 January 2019 (UTC)

Interesting, that further complicates the matter. Per utramque cavernam 16:56, 7 January 2019 (UTC)

No, what Fīrūzābādī writes is a classic folk-etymology; also he (whom Freytag translates) gives other meanings for the verb like “to run fast” and so writes Hommel that it seemed to the folk to come from “to run fast” – however I can attest no use of the verb. It’s from the Middle-Ages before philology was a science, ignore the derivations of Medieval Arabic dictionaries 🙄. The medieval Arabic dictionary compilators did not know any languages beside Arabic and Persian. Fay Freak (talk) 20:21, 7 January 2019 (UTC)