Talk:Israel
Etymology
[edit]I admit that this article does quote its sources, but a number of people who understand and speak Hebrew feel that scripture4all is mistaken when they write that Israel is based on a word meaning "upright". For this reason, a paragraph along those lines was deleted from the Wikipedia article about Israel, and that's why I deleted it here. This was done after discussion between the several parties on the discussion page there, which can be found at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:Israel#Origin_of_the_name_.22Israel.22 Please read that discussion, and then come back here to tell us what you think, and I hope we can come to some understanding. Thank you. --Keeves 16:46, 13 September 2006 (UTC)
I must admit that at first, I did not realize that you put both the KJV and the scripture4all translations in. I guess I can't complain too strongly, even though I disagree. I still think that scripture4all is objectively wrong, and I'd like to see it deleted from this article, but in the interest of free speech, I don't know if I'll be the one to delete it. (Meanwhile, that link does still work, so you can read that other discussion, despite the strikethrough formatting that I gave it.) --Keeves 16:57, 13 September 2006 (UTC)
- Yes, note that I'm representing the scripture4all word-by-word "translation" for what it is, nothing more or less. I do think it is of interest here. And I did read the entire discussion carefully. Robert Ullmann 19:38, 13 September 2006 (UTC)
German
[edit]Is it possible that the German name of Israel is neuter? --Abraham (talk) 07:01, 30 April 2016 (UTC)
Is the sense of all Jews derogatory?
[edit]Anti-Semites often talk about "Israel" as a code word for all Jews collectively. Is this notable for sense 5? ThighFish (talk) 09:05, 18 April 2021 (UTC)
- It has nothing to do with the state, and in fact long predates Zionism. The original sense was "children of Israel." So no, it's not antisemitic. It's the state that chose to name itself after what was already a collective term for Jews. פֿינצטערניש (Fintsternish), she/her (talk) 20:06, 21 April 2021 (UTC)
- Otherwise, the common English translation of the Shema would be antisemitic: "Hear, O Israel, the Lord is our God, the Lord is one." But it's obviously not antisemitic since it's borrowing a sense of "Israel" that long predates the state... פֿינצטערניש (Fintsternish), she/her (talk) 20:08, 21 April 2021 (UTC)
- I think context is important here, in a Jewish liturgical use it is in reference to the Jewish people (example of Shema translation above), but in a non-Jewish context I think that would likely be offensive (likely conflating State of Israel and Jewish people). A suggested edit for definition 5:
- (historical, now proscribed or sometimes offensive - continued modern liturgical use in Judaism) The Jews, taken collectively.
- 2024 August 24 (last accessed), My Jewish learning, The Shema[1]:
- Hear O’ Israel, the Lord is our God, the Lord is One
- 2024 August 24 (last accessed), My Jewish learning, The Shema[2]:
- For our ancestors, for us, for our children, for every generation of the people Israel, for all ages from the first to the last, His teachings are true, everlasting.
- --17:09, 24 August 2024 (UTC) Gimelthedog (talk) 17:09, 24 August 2024 (UTC)
Hey all: does part of this page help readers understand the disconnect between the spelling and pronunciation of this word? If you get fancy, English speakers can say "iss ra el", but usually we just say "is ree ul". That's the issue creating the eye-spelling "Isreal". Was this part of some vowel shift or what? --Geographyinitiative (talk) 19:25, 5 June 2022 (UTC)
/ˈɪzreɪel/ Formal and posh
[edit]In singing that an usually pronunciation too. JMGN (talk) 08:34, 11 April 2024 (UTC)