Talk:هو

Egyptian Arabic

Is "húwa" and "híya" the correct transliteration of Egyptian هو / هي? It seems to me that the Egyptians say "húwwa" and "híyya". —Stephen 18:59, 5 April 2009 (UTC)

And you are right. --Beru7 20:23, 5 April 2009 (UTC)

copulative meaning

Hi, should the copulative meaning be added in its entry? Thanks in advance. --Backinstadiums (talk) 11:11, 29 January 2017 (UTC)

Added. —Stephen ^(Talk) 10:39, 30 January 2017 (UTC)

ـنِي ‎(-nī)/ـنِيَ ‎(-niya)/ـي ‎(-ī)/ـيَ ‎(-ya)*

@151.255.84.37 HI, I cannot find any example or explanation about ـنِيَ ‎(-niya). Could sb please add them? Thanks in advance. --Backinstadiums (talk) 21:11, 5 February 2017 (UTC)

هو is the wrong place to look. It isn't related. Try أنا, and also look for prepositions such as من. —Stephen ^(Talk) 02:14, 7 February 2017 (UTC)

@Stephen G. Brown There's no example in the whole wikipedia using ـنِيَ ‎(-niya). Is it MSA? Could you add one? --Backinstadiums (talk) 08:21, 7 February 2017 (UTC)

I can't think of any example. To me, it looks like a mistake. @Stephen G. Brown An example of -nī is رَأَيْتَنِي (raʔaytanī) (you saw me). I think that is probably the ending that you are referring to. —Stephen ^(Talk) 08:50, 7 February 2017 (UTC)

@Stephen G. Brown 'whehre did you find it?', For example in this entry https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/هو#See_also . Who added that info.? --Backinstadiums (talk) 09:07, 7 February 2017 (UTC)

It was added by User:176.47.98.29 here. —Stephen ^(Talk) 09:47, 7 February 2017 (UTC)

@Backinstadiums, Stephen G. Brown I have added three out four example endings at أَنَا (ʔanā). The fourth one is something like أَرَادَنِيَ (ʔarādaniya) but I haven't found the rule yet (after a quick search). You can also ask @Benwing2, Wikitiki89 about the Arabic grammar.--Anatoli T. ^{(обсудить}/^вклад) 10:56, 7 February 2017 (UTC)

And @Erutuon. --Anatoli T. ^{(обсудить}/^вклад) 10:57, 7 February 2017 (UTC)

Or إِلَيَّ (ʔilayya) —Stephen ^(Talk) 12:03, 7 February 2017 (UTC)

┌────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────┘ Typing in Arabic is pain in the butt. You might as well acquire a grammar reference, e.g. "A Student Grammar of Modern Standard Arabic" by Eckehard Schulz or "An Introduction to Koranic & Classical Arabic" by Wheeler M. Thackston. --Anatoli T. ^{(обсудить}/^вклад) 11:00, 7 February 2017 (UTC)

@Atitarev the problem is the ending ـنِيَ ‎(-niya), which doesn't appear even in this weird alternative inflection https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/من#Inflection . I've written comments on several similar issues in many arabic entries' discussion sections. --Backinstadiums (talk) 11:22, 7 February 2017 (UTC)

@Backinstadiums I couldn't find anything. We can remove it, until its existence is confirmed. --Anatoli T. ^{(обсудить}/^вклад) 11:28, 7 February 2017 (UTC)

I have removed ـنِيَ ‎(-niya) from {{ar-personal pronouns}} for now. --Anatoli T. ^{(обсудить}/^вклад) 11:31, 7 February 2017 (UTC)

┌────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────┘ AFAIK there is no such pronoun as ـنِيَ (niya). Benwing2 (talk) 11:33, 7 February 2017 (UTC) @Atitarev If you use a Mac, I have a special keyboard layout that I created that makes it relatively easy to type vocalized Arabic text phonetically. Benwing2 (talk) 11:34, 7 February 2017 (UTC)

@Atitarev I think that last ping failed. Benwing2 (talk) 11:34, 7 February 2017 (UTC)

@Benwing2 I got it, thanks. No, I use Windows. On Firefox, I've got a "character palette" plug-in but people currently can't edit in Forefox in Wikimedia projects. --Anatoli T. ^{(обсудить}/^вклад) 11:40, 7 February 2017 (UTC)

@Atitarev When I used to use Windows, I created a similar keyboard layout in Ukelele. This was several Windows versions ago but I imagine it will still work. The idea used on my Mac layout is that short vowels are on a i u, tanwīn short vowels are on A I U, shadda is on semicolon, sukūn is on o, long vowels are on e y w, tāˀ marbūṭa is on p or O, ʿayn is on `, alif maqsūra is on Y, \ is a dead key for typing hamzas of various sorts, etc. The Windows layout works a bit differently but the basic idea is the same. I can email it to you if you're interested. Benwing2 (talk) 12:02, 7 February 2017 (UTC)

@Benwing2 Yes, please, if it's not a big trouble. --Anatoli T. ^{(обсудить}/^вклад) 12:22, 7 February 2017 (UTC)

Is it possible that the -iya forms are used when followed by an hamzat al-wasl? If so, we should mention this, but not give it as a separate form (normally -ī is simply shortened to -i before hamzat al-wasl). --WikiTiki89 14:33, 9 February 2017 (UTC)

I don't know but I suspect not. I thought -ī was still written as such before hamzat al-waṣl, although it very well might be shortened in pronunciation. Benwing2 (talk) 14:49, 9 February 2017 (UTC)

Yes, it's still written as -ī (probably only because there is no way in Arabic to show that a seemingly long vowel is actually short, just like the situation in أُولَاء (ʾulāʾ)), but it could be that for the first-person single suffix pronoun, it becomes -iya instead (in which case it would be written -iya as well, just like with other things that end in sukuun). Of course, I'm just speculating, trying to figure out what -iya and -niya could be. But it's not that far-fetched of an idea. Also, I might mention that in older Semitic languages -ī and -iya coexisted as different case forms (I forget the exact details). --WikiTiki89 15:50, 9 February 2017 (UTC)

@Benwing2: I think my speculation is right. See for example

609–632 CE, Qur'an, 2:40:

نِعْمَتِيَ ٱلَّتِي (niʕmatiya llatī). --WikiTiki89 20:33, 13 February 2017 (UTC)

@Wikitiki89: Could you specify what speculation you're referring to? Furthermore, shouldn't the statement "(-ya) is attached to nouns whose construct state ends in a long vowel or diphthong" be reworded to cover cases such as أخي 'my brother' nom./acc./gen.? --Backinstadiums (talk) 08:31, 24 April 2017 (UTC)