Talk:not give someone the time of day

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Latest comment: 2 years ago by Fytcha in topic RFD discussion: March 2021–January 2022
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RFM discussion: November 2020–March 2021

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Clearly need merging under give the time of day (compare give a damn, give a shit). Benwing2 (talk) 02:29, 8 November 2020 (UTC)Reply

Support, this makes sense and is an obvious fix. Rauisuchian (talk) 17:58, 30 November 2020 (UTC)Reply


RFD discussion: March 2021–January 2022

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The following discussion has been moved from Wiktionary:Requests for deletion (permalink).

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Reduced to its current form by @Mihia after a discussion at RFM. —Μετάknowledgediscuss/deeds 23:22, 8 March 2021 (UTC)Reply

I'd go the other way: give someone the time of day is NISoP; not give someone the time of day is a negative polatity item with a non-SoP meaning because of its discourse function.
In the past I'd thought that we'd want to make it clear that not is not an essential element of the collocation. Now I think the not is an essential indication of the nature of the idiom that is visible in links, category listing etc. I believe that, for almost all negative polarity items, typing the item without not into the search box will still lead to the term with not. DCDuring (talk) 00:26, 9 March 2021 (UTC)Reply
It does seem to hinge on whether the positive expression viably exists. Presently there is a positive example, "If you're lucky, she might give you the time of day". If we accept examples such as these as valid then I think we would need an entry for the positive version. Mihia (talk) 11:18, 9 March 2021 (UTC)Reply
Here are some positively positive examples: [1]; [2]; [3]; [4]; [5].  --Lambiam 10:38, 11 March 2021 (UTC)Reply
However, we now have both a positive and a negative idiomatic sense at give the time of day, implying that the negative sense is not merely the negative of the positive sense -- so, if we're saying that it is, then the problem is just transferred to another place. In that case, we should label the positive sense "often in the negative", and put the negative examples there too, rather than list the negative sense separately. Mihia (talk) 18:21, 17 March 2021 (UTC)Reply
IMO the negative sense is merely the negative of the positive sense; not to give someone the time of day is to not acknowledge them, to not give them respect or attention. The idiom see eye to eye is labelled (chiefly in the negative); we can do the same here.  --Lambiam 09:03, 20 March 2021 (UTC)Reply
@DCDuring, Mihia, Lambian I'm not too concerned, I think sense 2 is just emphasizing the negative and giving negative synonyms. But yes, they could be combined as suggested. Facts707 (talk) 10:34, 30 October 2021 (UTC)Reply
@Facts707 It seems strange to me to have definitions listed under give the time of day if that phrase is not actually used verbatim at all (but only with a noun inserted in the middle). Is this conventional? - excarnateSojourner (talk|contrib) 16:17, 29 October 2021 (UTC)Reply
@excarnateSojourner I don't think the order of the object, etc. is particularly important; I modified one example and added a quotation in the form "give the time of day [to someone]". Facts707 (talk) 10:17, 30 October 2021 (UTC)Reply

RFD-redirected almost a year ago Special:Diff/61981774/62145274. — Fytcha T | L | C 03:31, 11 January 2022 (UTC)Reply