User talk:Rgt2002

Thank You!

Hi! Thanks for your contributions to the Tagalog content of Wiktionary. I see that some of your contributions are from Ilocano, Bontoc, Kankanaey, and Kalinga. You're from Northern Luzon? I'm also curious what your profession that you would know much about Tagalog and how to code the template. Anyway, I've been wanting for years to have a Tagalog conjugation template in Wiktionary but I don't know how to code it. However, I stopped wanting it because I thought of some problems about having one unified Tagalog conjugation template. Anyway, I think we can solve these problems, and I look forward to the potentials of this template. So, if you don't mind, I'd like to discuss some potential problems that we may encounter with the template.

1. As you know and noted under the table, not all conjugations are possible for all verbs. Is there an option to not show one trigger or one focus? That's a potential solution. Each editor can possibly omit a certain trigger or focus if it's not possible. For example, in kain, I see "kumain" and "magkain". Obviously, "magkain" is not possible. Also "tuwa". "Matuwa" is possible, but "tumuwa" or "magtuwa" is not. So, maybe there's a way to omit this row from the table.

2. I see that you included both the "-um-" and the "mag-" in one table, which could be problematic if they mean different things for a specific verb. For example, the word bili. "Bumili" means "to buy", but "magbili" means "to sell". Also, there's a trend of "mag-" being transitive (or meaning that it's not acting upon the person doing the action), and "um-" being intransitive (or meaning that it's acting upon the person doing the action), noticeably very similar to the French difference of "avoir monté" and "être monté". In Tagalog, something like the word "alis". "Umalis" means "to leave or depart" (which is acting upon the person doing the action) and "mag-alis" means "to remove or take way" (which is not acting upon the person doing the action). How do we differentiate these differences in the entries? So since the problem here is the meaning can either correspond to an "-um" or a "mag-", I think we can indicate in the definitions of the verb, whether the definition corresponds to an "-um" or a "mag-". What do you think?

3. I also think we should only have one single entry that contains the conjugation box, just like in European language verb entries. Only the main dictionary word has the conjugation. We can't have "bumili", "bilhin", and "bili" all having the conjugation table. So which one? I think it's either 1.) the root word, or 2.) the actor focus word (Actor I or II, if impossible then Actor III). The advantage of Option 2 is that we don't have to differentiate the definitions whether it corresponds to an "-um" or a "mag-". The advantage of Option 1 is that it's all in one entry. I think Option 2 is better. What do you think?

4. I think that in order for people to know what each conjugation means, or what each focus and trigger means, the affixes need to correspond to an entry defining the affix. Similar to what you see in dictionaries, like what we have in -in.

5. Should we make each possible conjugation to have an entry like in European languages? In the conjugation of European language verbs, each form has an entry. However, in languages like Japanese and Korean, they don't. What do you think? I feel that it's hard work, but it's more convenient to have a very small entry for each conjugation. Especially those that really require their own entry because of extra nuisance in meaning with that specific form, or that form being used in another part of speech in some cases.

6. Furthermore, I'm not sure if you know this but there are still some mistakes in the conjugation template. Like for example, in bumili, I can see "{{{in3}}}ibinili" in the table. Anyway, I think you're fixing it.

7. I see also another problem of non-native Tagalog speakers interchanging "-um-" and "mag-", like for "takbo", the correct one is "tumakbo", but many non-native speakers say "magtakbo". Something to consider.

8. I think your conjugation table is a little lacking. Especially with the "plural conjugations", like "magsi-", "mangagsi-", and so on. Also "mapa-", "pa-in", "makapagpa-". Also the recent form (forgot what it's called formally. The "ka-", like "kabibili", "kaaalis".

9. Also, problems with words like "kabibili" and "kabibili", one is formal and one is informal. Include both?

10. I'm also thinking, should it be called "conjugation"? Many books use "inflections". Some use "derivations". Some use "case system". Or "forms".

I'd really like to know your thoughts about this. Looking forward to better Tagalog content here. :) --Mar vin kaiser (talk) 16:12, 20 July 2016 (UTC)

Hi! Kamusta ka!

First of all, you're welcome!

Yes, I'm a Cordilleran. My ancestors come from most of Cordillera and the Ilocos Region. My mother's side comes from Sagada and Bontoc, while my father's side comes from much of Ifugao.

I'm just a student studying in Baguio City. I'm mostly a shy person so I don't like revealing myself too much to unknown people.

I've been learning some Wiki code recently and I noticed the lack of Tagalog content in Wiktionary. I'm just beginning to understand how to make table templates. Basic coding for me is quite easy since I've already learned HTML and CSS but I still have to learn the code used by Wiki.

I'm trying to see what I could do with the "conjugation" table template and here are my thoughts to the problems you have said to me:

1. I'm trying to find the option on completely omitting rows, and that's the only thing I have to find to solve this problem.
2. Maybe if we try emphasizing that they have different meanings and link to the root word of those two words.
3. I prefer using the root word. The root word is what I use to creating pages so to put the most detail in one entry.
4. I'm also planning on adding links to each affix and explain what that affix means.
5. Ok, I approve it! :)
6. Yes, I'm still fixing that, and I usually leave my work undone since I'm already into staying up at night.
7. Like problem 1, I could omit the row that is not used correctly, or if there's some individual form I should clear out, then I could do it, if only I know how to.
8. Yes, I know. There are so many Tagalog affixes that modify verbs and it would crowd the table with a whole lot of forms. I'm also planning on adding the recently complete form (or katatapos in Tagalog) but I'm thinking on where exactly to put it in the table.
9. Kindly clarify this problem... :).
10. Well, I'm not really sure but when the template was first created by someone else, it was called "Verb conjugations".

Take note that I'm still learning Wiki code, and I didn't overlook or even realize to these problems, some I already know.

Those Kalinga and Bontoc words are from some archives I stumbled upon in the Internet and I decided to add the words into Wiktionary.

Ilokano and Northern Kankanay (the one spoken in Mountain Province and not in Benguet) entries are ones that I and my family already know.

I'm also looking forward to more Tagalog content and improvements to the conjugation table, and also support to those more irregular verbs like alalahanin or manganganak.

Can you tell some things about yourself too, like where you live and profession? I've seen that you know not only English and Tagalog, but also some Chinese, Spanish and French, that's awesome!

Thank you for patience.

Hanggang sa muli!

Enggana maminsan! (Until one time)

Is awni kasin! (Later again)

(sorry for misplacing this message, it's my first time replying here...)

Thank you suzukaze (t・c) for noting me of redirection.

Rgt2002 (talk) 03:32, 22 July 2016 (UTC)

Hi! I'm a Chinese-Filipino college student in Manila. That's why I know Chinese, and the Spanish and French, that's just a hobby. Anyway, I'd like to discuss some more issues with the Tagalog verb conjugation tables.

1. Yes, we really need a way to remove rows. Or at least the possibility of leaving it blank.
2. I would like to discuss this together with No.3.
3. After doing some verbs using the table, I found out that there's a disadvantage when using the root word for the single entry that contains the conjugation table. That's because I think we also need conjugation tables for phrasal verbs and special irregular verbs. For phrasal verbs, an example would be "sira", and "masiraan ng loob". We have to have an entry for both, but one's not conjugated and one's conjugated, and we can't make an entry like "sira ng loob", it has to be "masiraan ng loob". For irregular verbs, we can create a different entry for them with their own conjugation table. Furthermore, about the differences in "mag-" and "-um", sometimes, their conjugation is also different in other focuses. Therefore, I think it's better if we put the conjugation table in one actor focus verb.
4. Thanks!
5. Thanks!
6. Thanks!
7. Yeah..
8. This can be worked out in the future. Actually, there's a lot to add, still.
9. Additional problem to this. Sometimes, there are two alternatives available. I see you made this work with "maka-". However, sometimes "winasak" and "niwasak" are both acceptable, in the dictionary, and as of now, there's no option to put both.
10. Upon further research, yeah, I think the word "conjugation" is fitting.
11. Extra problem. I noticed that when I made a conjugation table for verbs ending in a vowel, which requires a dash, it doesn't appear, so that needs to be fixed.

Thanks for putting entries from the northern Philippine languages. I'm quite interested in learning Ilocano, and I have resources, but I just don't have the time right now. Also, there are only 48 Ilocano words in Wiktionary right now, and it would be great if you expanded it. Cheers. --Mar vin kaiser (talk) 17:29, 24 July 2016 (UTC)

Hi again! Thank you for discussing these problems to me and suggesting solutions for this template. I will accept all of your suggested solutions. For now, I'll say to other users that the template is still being worked on and should not be used regularly yet because of these problems.

I hope I could fix all these solutions soon enough. Once again, thanks for talking with me. I'll also add Ilocano content for you and others to learn. And, you're welcome!

Have a nice day. Kasta pay! (Till then!)

Rgt2002 (talk) 10:01, 25 July 2016 (UTC)

Hey, I'm just wondering. Are you making everything manually inputted? That's gonna take a really long time lol. --Mar vin kaiser (talk) 11:37, 28 July 2016 (UTC)

Not literally everything. It's just you can now choose which rows you want to cross out. There are some forms to manually type, but everything else will be based on those forms. Well, it's much better than manually typing everything. Hehe :) Rgt2002 (talk) 07:19, 2 August 2016 (UTC)

Welcome

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Enjoy your stay at Wiktionary! Chuck Entz (talk) 14:05, 21 July 2016 (UTC)

Conjugation of kain

Hello! I noticed that your tl-infl template as configured at kain does not conjugate correctly. Is this work in progress, i.e. waiting for some improvement in the template itself, or an oversight? (You gave kain as an example on the template's documentation page, and the parameters there look quite different from what you actually use. But I did not want to simply modify the kain entry, because if some template improvement is on the way, that would be of course counterproductive). Rbrunner7 (talk) 06:16, 9 September 2016 (UTC)

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Hey How are You

Hey! Are you still editing in Tagalog? Just wondering. Thanks. --Mar vin kaiser (talk) 16:01, 4 April 2017 (UTC)

It's just school. I'm very busy with our activities, but I hope I can come back to editing Tagalog as soon as vacation starts! :) Rgt2002 (talk) 18:03, 7 April 2017 (UTC)

How are you?

How are you? damn ive found your wikia (the link in your user page) like october 30 this year, then it seems like no one except you cared so I contributted to it. we could continue talking about this here there, but just found you here. you are busy with school eh? Great job doing stuff in multiple pages, may you have a great day! ジョヴ (talk) 21:14, 15 November 2018 (UTC)