Talk:여의자

RFV discussion: December 2019–January 2022

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여의자

Defined as "(Japan) girl". --Anatoli T. ^{(обсудить}/^вклад) 01:46, 26 December 2019 (UTC)

The entry has a reference. If you are looking for usage in a text, does such literature exist? —Suzukaze-c◇◇ 03:47, 26 December 2019 (UTC)

Google News Search gives several hits, also in articles that are not Japan-related. I cannot judge if any of this is durably archived.  --Lambiam 10:52, 26 December 2019 (UTC)

What does this mean?? Do we know? Is this used by Koreans living in Japan? It looks like they just added a third character into the existing word for girl , 여자. —Soap— 20:33, 11 January 2020 (UTC)

Soap: I'm confused by your question? Look at the entry. It explains right there what this means:

Calque of Japanese 女の子, from 여 (女, yeo, “woman, female”) +‎ 의 (ui, “-possessive particle”) +‎ 자 (子, ja, “child”)

Was there something else that you wanted to know about? ‑‑ Eiríkr Útlendi │^{Tala við mig} 19:31, 14 January 2020 (UTC)

I mean, is this a word used by Koreans living in Japan only? Or is it a term used by Koreans everywhere for girls living in Japan (presumably with a set of matching words for boys, men, and women)? Is the extra morpheme in the middle part of a wider trend? —Soap— 20:51, 14 January 2020 (UTC)

@Soap -- Thanks for clarifying. I'm not first-hand familiar with the Korean term, but "the extra morpheme in the middle", 의 (ui), is the possessive particle, mirroring the Japanese の (no) possessive particle in the source term that the Korean term is copying. It would be interesting and relevant, and arguably useful, to indicate if there are similar calques, perhaps standard Korean 남자 (namja, “boy”) shifting to 남의자 (namuija) to mirror the Japanese 男の子 (otoko no ko, “boy”), etc. I suspect the "Japan" label indicates that this is used primarily by speakers of Korean living in Japan, but I agree that this could be explained more clearly.

It might be useful to ping the editors who have worked on this entry: @Suzukaze-c, 幻光尘, Atitarev, do you all have any further information or insights? ‑‑ Eiríkr Útlendi │^{Tala við mig} 22:51, 14 January 2020 (UTC)

The label is still not clear. The way I read it, it's the term used by Koreans living in Japan but I'm not certain. I asked for an RFV in hope it would clarify or at least, demonstrate that the term is actually used. --Anatoli T. ^{(обсудить}/^вклад) 23:55, 14 January 2020 (UTC)

The book named in the references section is called Language of Koreans in Japan. —Suzukaze-c◇◇ 06:17, 15 January 2020 (UTC)

The 여의자 in those news articles is a conjugated form of the verb 여의다 and has nothing to do with Japanese 女の子.

Also, if I remember correctly, there is no 두음 법칙 in Zainichi Korean. So the calque of 女の子 in Zainichi Korean (if it actually exists) should be 녀의자 instead of 여의자. --99.231.5.35 04:24, 3 October 2021 (UTC)

Closed: no action taken. —Fish bowl (talk) 04:26, 12 January 2022 (UTC)

남의자

Unlisted. —Fish bowl (talk) 04:26, 12 January 2022 (UTC)

Closed: no action taken. —Fish bowl (talk) 04:26, 12 January 2022 (UTC)