Talk:coop

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Existence[edit]

Is 'cooped' a word? —This unsigned comment was added by 138.192.17.118 (talk) at 07:51, 25 March 2007‎.

Yes, there is such a word. — SMUconlaw (talk) 08:19, 29 June 2016 (UTC)

Third meaning[edit]

Cooperative - as in the Wikipedia article. But can it be classified as an abbreviation? --Mortense (talk) 06:14, 5 March 2012 (UTC)

Yes check.svg Done Equinox 09:18, 29 June 2016 (UTC)

"Basket" sense[edit]

Should probably be under Middle English- the OED has only citations from the 14th century, and none of this spelling. DTLHS (talk) 21:33, 28 June 2016 (UTC)

Will let a Middle English expert deal with this. OED had it as the first sense in its definition, so I added it. I wonder if the "barrel or cask" sense is also Middle English? — SMUconlaw (talk) 08:02, 29 June 2016 (UTC)
I took a stab at creating the Middle English entry based on the Middle English Dictionary Online – see "coupe#Middle English". Improvement welcome. — SMUconlaw (talk) 15:16, 29 June 2016 (UTC)

"To make or repair barrels"[edit]

Can't find any cites for this sense, or source the given Holland quote beyond mentions in dictionaries. DTLHS (talk) 16:35, 29 June 2016 (UTC)

Possible:

  1. 1989, Secondary Wood Products Manufacturers Directory, Directory Department of Miller Freeman:
    Wine barrels & re-cooped hopheads.
    (might be misspelling of recouped)
  2. 1884, Bulletin of the United States National Museum[1], number 27:
    The iron-sheaths for the heads of the instruments are made of white pine, two pieces, gouged or cooped out; fastened together with wooden pins, or slugs of lead, covered with canvas, and painted; usually made at sea.
  3. 2011, Joke Spaans, Graphic Satire and Religious Change: The Dutch Republic 1676-1707[2]:
    Earlier we saw that cooping a barrel stands for forging a conspiracy—here we see the opposite.
  4. 2016, Cathal J. Nolan, The Age of Wars of Religion, 1000-1650:
    When two dozen or more rings of iron were assembled around lengths of iron in this way they created a type of simple tube, termed a "barrel" from its manufacturing origin in cooping.
The 2011 and 2016 quotations look good. There isn't enough context for the 1989 quotation, while the 1884 one is a scanno for scooped. It's surprising that older quotations for this sense are so difficult to find. — SMUconlaw (talk) 17:15, 29 June 2016 (UTC)

coop[edit]

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The following discussion has been moved from Wiktionary:Requests for verification.

This discussion is no longer live and is left here as an archive. Please do not modify this conversation, but feel free to discuss its conclusions.


"A barrel or cask for liquor." This sense does not appear in the OED, and I can't locate any quotations. Does the request for quotations tag suggest this definition is from Johnson's Dictionary? — SMUconlaw (talk) 19:35, 28 June 2016 (UTC)

Johnson is Samuel Johnson, so most probably yes. It seems plausible (cooper = barrel-maker) but I can't find uses either. I found a "coop of ale" but it turned out to be an eye-dialect spelling of "cup". Equinox 19:51, 28 June 2016 (UTC)
I did searches using QQ with the term coop together with distill, gin, liquor, rum, vodka and whisky. Nothing. — SMUconlaw (talk) 19:58, 28 June 2016 (UTC)
You can find this exact definition in many older dictionaries, but with no reference to any Johnson, and it's not in Samuel Johnson's dictionary. I wonder if the quotation was supposed to be for a different sense. DTLHS (talk) 20:19, 28 June 2016 (UTC)
Century doesn't restrict the contents to liquor and says that any container of stave-and-hoop construction is a coop, with kegs, barrels, pails, and casks all specifically included. DCDuring TALK 20:31, 28 June 2016 (UTC)
I couldn't find it in the sense in question in Google Books in the vicinity of beer, corn, brine, or water. DCDuring TALK 20:48, 28 June 2016 (UTC)
Nor in the vicinity of hoop or stave. DCDuring TALK 20:51, 28 June 2016 (UTC)

──────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────── I found the definition referring to liquor; it is from Webster, and he cites Johnson. However, Johnson uses liquid, so Webster must have been using liquor in its older sense of "liquid" rather than in the modern sense of "distilled beverage". However, these are mere dictionary entries. For what it is worth I've added them to the entry for the time being. Could this be a sense current only in Middle (or Old) English? — SMUconlaw (talk) 21:03, 28 June 2016 (UTC)

The Middle English Dictionary has coupe, cupe (cupa?), cowp(e) meaning, among other things, "a tub or cask", with some quotations. Our own entry coupe has "a barrel or cask for holding liquids". Hence, if this isn't attested in English, it will as you suspect be preservable as Middle English. - -sche (discuss) 23:01, 29 June 2016 (UTC)
(I created the Middle English entry based on information in the MED. Face-smile.svg) — SMUconlaw (talk) 18:49, 1 July 2016 (UTC)
OK, I think we can regard this as having passed. — SMUconlaw (talk) 19:40, 25 July 2016 (UTC)