User talk:Tibidibi

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๐Ÿ—„

้‡‘ๆฐธ็›Š[edit]

So who exactly is this lad, writing in Classical Chinese in 1946? I'd love to see more, but a reverse search of the text gives no results.

I've been reminded of another passage containing the word(s) ๆ™‚ๅ‹™, written by the Confucian scholar Hwang Hyun (้ปƒ็Žน) in 1894, soon after the Gabo Reforms: ๆ™‚ไบฌไธญๅฎ˜ๅ ฑๅŠๅค–้“ๆ–‡็งป, ็š†็œž่ซบ็›ธ้Œฏ, ไปฅ็ถดๅญ—ๅฅ, ็›–ๆ•ˆๆ—ฅๆœฌๆ–‡ๆณ•ไนŸ. ๆˆ‘ๅœ‹ๆ–น่จ€, ๅค็จฑ่ฏๆ–‡ๆ›ฐ็œžๆ›ธ, ็จฑ่จ“ๆฐ‘ๆญฃ้Ÿณๆ›ฐ่ซบๆ–‡, ๆ•…็ตฑ็จฑ็œž่ซบ, ๅŠ็”ฒๅˆ(้ซ˜ๅฎ—ไธ‰ๅไธ€ๅนด) ๅพŒ่ถจๆ™‚ๅ‹™่€…็››ๆŽจ่ซบๆ–‡ๆ›ฐๅœ‹ๆ–‡, ๅˆฅ็œžๆ›ธไปฅๅค–ไน‹ๆ›ฐๆผขๆ–‡, ๆ–ผๆ˜ฏๅœ‹ๆผขๆ–‡ไธ‰ๅญ—้‚ๆˆๆ–น่จ€, ่€Œ็œž่ซบไน‹็จฑๆณฏ็„‰, ๅ…ถ็‹‚ไฝป่€…ๅ€กๆผขๆ–‡็•ถๅปขไน‹่ซ–, ็„ถๅ‹ขๆ ผ่€Œๆญขใ€‚ I strongly recommend perusing the following article by W. Scott Wells, in which he attempts to paint a cogent picture of the trailblazing changes in the writing style of the late Joseon Dynasty, as they were shaped by the unfolding modernisation. https://www.academia.edu/999697/From_Center_to_Periphery_The_Demotion_of_Literary_Sinitic_and_the_Beginnings_of_Hanmunkwa_Korea_1876_1910

- Your eternal comrade, Michael Lawrence.

@Michael D. Lawrence, ้‡‘ๆฐธ็›Š is an extremely obscure Confucian scholar (lived 1886โ€”1962) who was appalled by the ไธ–่ฎŠ๏ผไธ–ๅ˜ (shรฌbiร n) of modernity, as the various quotes I've added make clear. An anthology of his works was published recently, which I'm quoting from.
He was probably the penultimate generation to be fully trained in the classics in the traditional fashion.
There are still people in Korea who compose in Classical Chinese, by the way. AFAIK almost all poetry, though.--Tibidibi (talk) 11:06, 24 August 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Tibidibi thank you![edit]

I haven't edited in Wiktionary, but I sometimes search for words here, mainly about Korean and English etymology. I've found your contributions helpful: most of Korean dictionaries have little information about etymologies, but here I can figure out all the way down to Middle and Old Korean thanks to your contributions. Of course there are also other users active in Korean word articles, but you are one of the most-contributing users! If there were a barnstar in Wiktionary, I would give it to you. But since it isn't, I just wanna say THANK YOU!

I am a Korean native speaker, ๊ทธ๋ž˜์„œ ์ด์ œ ๋ง ์ข€ ๋†“์•„๋„ ๋˜์ฃ ? ์˜์–ด ์–ด๋ ค์›Œ์„œใ… ใ…  ์–ด์จŒ๋“  ๊ฐ์‚ฌํ•˜๋‹ค๋Š” ๋ง ์ „ํ•˜๊ณ  ์‹ถ์—ˆ์–ด์š”^^ ์•ž์œผ๋กœ๋„ ๋งŽ์€ ๊ธฐ์—ฌ ๋ถ€ํƒ๋“œ๋ฆฝ๋‹ˆ๋‹ค! --Uconhe (talk) 13:01, 26 September 2021 (UTC)[reply]

@Uconhe ์ •๋ง ๊ฐ์‚ฌํ•ฉ๋‹ˆ๋‹ค!! ํŠนํžˆ ์šฐ๋ฆฌ๋‚˜๋ผ์—์„œ ์›Œ๋‚™ ์ธ์ง€๋„๊ฐ€ ์—†์–ด์„œ ๊ฐ€๋”์€ ์ฝ๋Š” ์‚ฌ๋žŒ์ด ๋ช‡ ๋ช…์ด๋‚˜ ๋ ๊นŒ ์ด๋Ÿฐ ์ƒ๊ฐ๋„ ๋“ค์—ˆ๋Š”๋ฐ ์ •๋ง ํž˜์ด ๋˜๋„ค์š”... ใ…‹ใ…‹ใ…‹--Tibidibi (talk) 02:28, 29 September 2021 (UTC)[reply]

How is ไนฑ used in Korean? I found ๅฟƒ็ฅžๆฝฐไนฑ on s:ko:์˜ํ•™์–ดํœ˜, but the page said "ๆ˜ญๅ’Œไธƒๅนดๅ…ซๆœˆ". It may be an unorthodox form influenced by Japan. Crowley666 (talk) 12:08, 30 September 2021 (UTC)[reply]

@Crowley666 It's just an unorthodox variant, same as in Traditional Chinese. Tibidibi (talk) 13:55, 30 September 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Thanks. I've get rid of the L4 "Homophone" section. Crowley666 (talk) 14:37, 30 September 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Is this still wanted? โ€”Suzukaze-c (talk) 07:16, 13 November 2021 (UTC)[reply]

@Suzukaze-c No. Tibidibi (talk) 07:28, 13 November 2021 (UTC)[reply]

About the etymology of the Korean word ์ข†[edit]

์•ˆ๋…•ํ•˜์„ธ์š”, ํ˜น์‹œ '๋งˆ๊ฒฝํ—Œ์ง‘'์—์„œ์˜ ์˜› ์–ดํ˜• ํ™•์ธ์„ ์–ด๋–ค ์ถœ์ฒ˜๋ฅผ ํ†ตํ•ด์„œ ํ•˜์…จ๋‚˜์š”? ์ „์‚ฐํ™”๋œ ๋ฒ„์ „์œผ๋กœ ์ฐพ์•„๋ณด๊ณ  ์žˆ๋Š”๋ฐ, ๋ชจ๋‘ ํ•œ๋ฌธ์ด๊ณ  ์ ์ž–์€ ํ•œ์‹œ๋ผ์„œ ์–ด๋Š ๋Œ€๋ชฉ์—์„œ ํ•ด๋‹น ์–ดํ˜•์„ ๋ฐœ๊ฒฌํ•˜์…จ๋Š”์ง€ ๊ถ๊ธˆํ•ฉ๋‹ˆ๋‹ค. ํ˜น์‹œ ํ•ด๋‹น ๋ถ€๋ถ„์„ ํŽธ์ง‘ํ•˜์…จ๋‹ค๋ฉด ๋‹ต๋ณ€ ์ฃผ์‹œ๋ฉด ๊ฐ์‚ฌ๋“œ๋ฆฌ๊ฒ ์Šต๋‹ˆ๋‹ค! 223.38.52.91 16:26, 3 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]

โ€˜๋งˆ๊ฒฝํ—Œ์ง‘โ€™์ด ์•„๋‹ˆ๋ผ โ€˜๋งˆ๊ฒฝ์ดˆ์ง‘์–ธํ•ด(้ฆฌ็ถ“ๆŠ„้›†่ซบ่งฃ)โ€™์ž…๋‹ˆ๋‹ค. ์˜ค๋ฅ˜ ๊ด€๋ จํ•ด์„œ ์‚ฌ๊ณผ์˜ ๋ง์”€ ๋“œ๋ฆฝ๋‹ˆ๋‹ค. ์ด์ œ ์ •์ •๋˜์—ˆ์Šต๋‹ˆ๋‹ค.โ€”Tibidibi (talk) 11:13, 4 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Battery in Korean[edit]

How accurate do you think this video is: [1]? It says that the Korean word for "battery" differs between China and South Korea. The dog2 (talk) 07:22, 12 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]

@The dog2 It is not true WRT this word. ์ „์ง€ is used very commonly in Korea; itโ€™s just a little more formal than ๋ฐง๋ฐ๋ฆฌ or ๋ฐฐํ„ฐ๋ฆฌ.--Tibidibi (talk) 08:56, 12 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Speaking of which, I wonder if you can use that video to create entries for words in the dialects of Korean that are spoken in China, because I unfortunately haven't mastered hangul. If you want, I can read Chinese, so I can tell you which dialect each of the four words are referring to. The top left one is from Yanbian, the bottom left one is from Harbin, the top middle one is from Shenyang and the one on the right is the standard South Korean word. The dog2 (talk) 18:40, 12 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]

When you made this edit you broke ่‡ฃ and ๅ…•, which have |3=CL-OB in {{zh-x}} (oddly, you were the one who added that to ๅ…• back in September). My apologies if you were planning to check CAT:E and fix any errors, and just hadn't got to it, but it does need to be taken care of. Thanks! Chuck Entz (talk) 06:29, 13 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]

tr[edit]

ๅˆๅฑ้Ÿณ, Reconstruction:Proto-Koreanic/hoL ๋“ฑ์—์„œ ์“ด tr ๋ณ€์ˆ˜(oko *CHEsem, *oL)์— ๋Œ€ํ•œ ๊ทœ์ •์€ ์–ด๋””์„œ ํ™•์ธํ•  ์ˆ˜ ์žˆ๋‚˜์š”? ํ‘œ๊ธฐ ์ž์ฒด๋Š” ์˜ˆ์ผ ํ‘œ๊ธฐ์ธ ๊ฒƒ ๊ฐ™์œผ๋ฉด์„œ๋„ ์ผ๋ถ€ ๋Œ€๋ฌธ์ž๋กœ ํ‘œ๊ธฐ๋œ ๊ฒƒ์„ ๋ณด๋ฉด ๋˜ ์•„๋‹Œ ๊ฑฐ ๊ฐ™๊ณ  Wiktionary:Transliteration and romanization์—์„œ๋„ ์ฐพ์•„๋ณผ ์ˆ˜๊ฐ€ ์—†์–ด์„œ ์—ฌ์ญค ๋ด…๋‹ˆ๋‹ค. 120.50.78.167 16:45, 7 July 2022 (UTC)[reply]

์ฐจ์žํ‘œ๊ธฐ๋ฅผ ๋กœ๋งˆ์ž๋กœ ์˜ฎ๊ธธ ๋•Œ ํ›ˆ๋…์ž๋กœ ํ‘œ๊ธฐ๋˜๋Š” ์š”์†Œ๋ฅผ ๋Œ€๋ฌธ์ž๋กœ ๋‚˜ํƒ€๋‚ด๋Š” ๊ฒŒ ํ•™๊ณ„์˜ ๊ด€๋ก€๋ผ๊ณ  ์•Œ๊ณ  ์žˆ์Šต๋‹ˆ๋‹ค. ์ด๋ฅผ ํ†ตํ•ด ์–ด๋””๊นŒ์ง€๊ฐ€ ๋ฌธ์ž ์ฒด๊ณ„์—์„œ ์ง์ ‘ ์ฆ๋น™๋˜๋Š” ๊ฒƒ์ด๊ณ , ์–ด๋””๊นŒ์ง€๊ฐ€ ํ•™์ž์˜ ๋ณต์› ๋‚ด์ง€ ์ถ”์ธก์ธ์ง€ ํ•œ ๋ˆˆ์— ์•Œ ์ˆ˜ ์žˆ์Šต๋‹ˆ๋‹ค. ์ผ๋ก€๋กœ, ๋ณด๋นˆ์ด ์ €์ˆ ํ•œ ์ด ๋…ผ๋ฌธ์„ ๋ณด๋ฉด ๅ€ญ็†๋ฅผ <YEri>๋กœ, ๆ˜Ÿๅˆฉ๋ฅผ <PYEri>๋กœ ํ‘œ๊ธฐํ•˜๊ณ  ์žˆ์Šต๋‹ˆ๋‹ค. ์ด๋Š” ๋น„๋‹จ ๊ตญ์–ดํ•™์—๋งŒ ํ•ด๋‹น๋˜๋Š” ๊ฒŒ ์•„๋‹ˆ๋ผ, ์ค‘์„ธํŽ˜๋ฅด์‹œ์•„์–ด๋‚˜ ์•„์นด๋“œ์–ด์™€ ๊ฐ™์ด ํ›ˆ๋…์„ ์‚ฌ์šฉํ•˜๋Š” ๋ชจ๋“  ๊ณ ๋Œ€ ์–ธ์–ด์— ์ ์šฉ๋˜๋Š” ์›์น™์ž…๋‹ˆ๋‹ค. ๐ญฌ๐ญซ๐ญช๐ญ  (MLKA /โ ลกฤhโ /)์˜ ๊ฒฝ์šฐ๋ฅผ ๋ด๋„ ์•Œ ์ˆ˜ ์žˆ์ง€์š”.
*oL์˜ ๊ฒฝ์šฐ๋Š” ํ•ด๋‹น ๋‹จ์–ด์—์„œ <l>์˜ ์ง„๊ฐ€๊ฐ€ */l/์ด์—ˆ๋Š”์ง€, *r๊ณ„ ์Œ์ด์—ˆ๋Š”์ง€ ํ™•์‹ค์น˜ ์•Š๋‹ค๋Š” ๊ฒƒ์„ ๋ณด์—ฌ์ฃผ๊ณ ์ž ๋Œ€๋ฌธ์ž๋ฅผ ์‚ฌ์šฉํ•œ ๊ฒƒ์ด์—ˆ๋Š”๋ฐ, ๋‹ค์‹œ ์ƒ๊ฐํ•ด๋ณด๋‹ˆ ์ž„์˜๋กœ ์˜ˆ์ผ ํ‘œ๊ธฐ๋ฅผ ์–ด๊ธฐ๋Š” ๊ฒƒ์€ ์ž˜๋ชป๋œ ๋“ฏํ•ด *hol๋กœ ๋ฌธ์„œ๋ฅผ ์˜ฎ๊ฒผ์Šต๋‹ˆ๋‹ค.--Tibidibi (talk) 00:51, 11 July 2022 (UTC)[reply]
๋‹ต๋ณ€์ด ๋Šฆ์—ˆ๋„ค์š”. ๊ฐ์‚ฌํ•ฉ๋‹ˆ๋‹ค. ๊ทธ๋ ‡๋‹ค๋ฉด ๋Œ€๋ฌธ์ž V๋Š” ํŠน์ •ํ•  ์ˆ˜ ์—†๋Š” ๋ชจ์Œ(vowel)์„ ์˜๋ฏธํ•˜๋Š” ๊ฒƒ์ธ๊ฐ€์š”? --49.142.62.180 19:48, 6 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
๋Šฆ์€ ๋‹ต๋ณ€ ์‚ฌ๊ณผ๋“œ๋ฆฝ๋‹ˆ๋‹ค. ํŠน์ •ํ•  ์ˆ˜ ์—†๋Š” ๋ชจ์Œ์„ ๋œปํ•˜๋Š” ๊ฒŒ ๋งž์Šต๋‹ˆ๋‹ค.โ€”Tibidibi (talk) 11:22, 1 September 2022 (UTC)[reply]

ๆœจ[edit]

https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/%E6%9C%A8#Japanese

I think it is correct to classify the Goguryeo placenames of Placename glosses in the Samguk-sagi as pseudo-Goguryeo in this wiki article.

ไธ€็ญ‰[edit]

Japanese ็‰‡ (kata, "one of pair") never be able to be a Korean origin. That ward is cognate with ่‚ฉ (kata, "shoulder") according to accent pattern, and appeared with its many compounds which never thought borrowed words over 500 years before Samguk-Yusa (1281) had been written. Kojiki (712) is older than even the time asserted to be when Jemangmae-ga was written (750). To assert younger language be ancestor of older language is super inapropriate, don't you think?--่’ๅทปใƒขใƒญใ‚พใƒ• (talk) 08:17, 13 November 2022 (UTC)[reply]

It could be borrowed from an earlier language before Old Korean. Chuterix (talk) 05:55, 29 June 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Revisiting, I already asked this (potentially disrespectful) question in your talk page as basically your same "oH sO aN oLd kOrEaN bOrRoWiNg iS sUpEr iNaPpRoPrIaTe InCoNcLuSiVeLy?" Style: "was it more than excessively inappropriate for you to leave without warning?" Of course I know this is a volunteer project. But if you're not happy with my changes for Proto-Japonic (removing unsourced diacritics), I will not feel bad for you. Chuterix (talk) 02:29, 6 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]
I'm talking to Mx. Aramaki here. Despite Tibidi also dead, Mx. Aramaki is a japonic critic. Chuterix (talk) 02:30, 6 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Oops I forgot tibidi only for koreqnic edits Chuterix (talk) 17:06, 14 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]

๊ฐ€๋žŒ[edit]

์‚ผ๊ตญ์‚ฌ๊ธฐ ์ง€๋ฆฌ์ง€์— ์–ธ๊ธ‰๋˜๋Š” ๊ฒƒ์€ ์•„๋‹Œ๋ฐ ๊ณ ๊ตฌ๋ ค ์ง€๋ช…์–ด ๊ฐ€๋ผํ™€(ๅŠ ็พ…ๅฟฝ)์ด ์ˆ˜์„ฑ(ๆฐดๅŸŽ)์— ๋Œ€์‘๋˜๋Š” ์‚ฌ๋ก€๊ฐ€ ์กฐ์„ ์‹œ๋Œ€ ์ดˆ๊ธฐ ๋ฌธํ—Œ์— ๋ณด์ด๋Š”๋ฐ ์ด๊ฑด ์•„๋ฌด๋ž˜๋„ ํ•œ๊ตญ์–ด ๊ฐ€๋žŒ(ๆฑŸ)์— ๋Œ€์‘๋˜๋Š” ํ‘œ๊ธฐ์ธ๊ฒƒ ๊ฐ™์Šต๋‹ˆ๋‹ค.

Although ํ‘œ์ค€๊ตญ์–ด๋Œ€์‚ฌ์ „ does not currently provide this in its entry, ํ‘œ์ค€๊ตญ์–ด๋Œ€์‚ฌ์ „ ํŽธ์ฐฌ์šฉ ์–ด์› ์ •๋ณด ์ž๋ฃŒ has this:

๋ˆˆ-๊ผฌ๋ฆฌ <๋ˆˆแ„ญแ…ฉ๋ฆฌ<์–ธ๋‘>โ†๋ˆˆ+แ„ญแ…ฉ๋ฆฌ <์–ธ๋‘ไธ‹:54a>

(์–ธ๋‘ is ์–ธํ•ด๋‘์ฐฝ์ง‘์š”(1608))

But since my knowledge of Early Modern Korean and Middle Korean is very limited, I'm not sure if I can add this etymology to the ๋ˆˆ๊ผฌ๋ฆฌ page. I hope this can be added by someone like you. --2607:FB91:3A3:201:854B:85A3:43D:F133 13:12, 27 December 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Thank you! --2607:FB91:39A:9FD8:4988:1963:7374:603F 08:13, 29 December 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Nihon Shoki source + other sources[edit]

You put this in ๆตท็ญ‰:

The Sino-Korean transcription of an Old Korean title in the kingdom of Silla varies orthographically between ๆณข็้ฃก and ๆตท้ฃก, where the first elements ๆณข็ and ๆตท (hวŽi) are apparently equivalent. ๆณข็, Old Chinese reading */pหaj trษ™[n]/, is thought to be a purely phonogramic writing of this same word. The Nihon Shoki transcribes the relevant element of the same title as ใƒใƒˆใƒช patori, further supporting the reading based on internal evidence.

First of all, where did you get this Silla title from?

Second and most importantly, where's the katakana source for the Nihon Shoki source?

@Tibidibi Chuterix (talk) 05:54, 29 June 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Where to find ํ–ฅ๊ฐ€ ํ•ด๋… ์ž๋ฃŒ์ง‘[edit]

Hi,

Would a copy of ํ–ฅ๊ฐ€ ํ•ด๋… ์ž๋ฃŒ์ง‘ be available for download? I see that it is found here (https://sites.google.com/site/dhhallym/%EA%B3%B5%EA%B0%9C%EC%9E%90%EB%A3%8C%EC%8B%A4/%ED%95%9C%EA%B5%AD%EA%B3%BC-%EB%B6%81%ED%95%9C%ED%95%B4%EC%99%B8-%ED%95%9C%EA%B5%AD%ED%95%99), but the page does not seem to have been updated for a while and it requires approval for download, so I was wondering if there is another way to obtain the document. Thank you! Abynnnni (talk) 16:12, 18 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]