Talk:opa

Deletion discussion

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opa

Is this word really used in English? Or is it just used transliterated in English-language texts where it's clear someone is actually speaking Greek? —Angr 13:58, 18 February 2013 (UTC)

Yes, it's used in English, but as a stereotypical Greek expression. As I mentioned in my reply over at Feedback, it looks like it's one of those cases like Gott in Himmel where it's supposed to be the other language, but isn't quite the same as it would be in that language (here, mostly, the difference is in the semantic scope of the term). But, of course, the proof of the pudding will be in the cites... Chuck Entz (talk) 16:47, 18 February 2013 (UTC)

Here's a few: [1], "Add a little "opa!" to your life", [2]. Chuck Entz (talk) 17:30, 18 February 2013 (UTC)

This is different from Gott in Himmel because this is written in another script, so any uses of opa in that spelling, while meant to be Greek, can never really be Greek and shouldn't have a Greek heading. —CodeCat 17:37, 18 February 2013 (UTC)

This is different from Gott in Himmel because "Gott in Himmel" is ungrammatical in German and thus never used in German, only in English, while opa is just Greek transcribed into the Latin alphabet for the benefit of English-speaking readers. That doesn't make it English. —Angr 17:55, 18 February 2013 (UTC)

Perhaps olé is a better comparison: I'm sure people who use it are aware of the Spanish word, but is it really Spanish when used in English? Chuck Entz (talk) 18:24, 18 February 2013 (UTC)

Opa Gangnam Style? Mglovesfun (talk) 10:46, 19 February 2013 (UTC)

Hello all, Gangnam Style is irrelevant. I am the one who added the definitions for 'opa' (disclaimer: native Greek speaker). I just created this account, I am new in this so please be patient with me. The notion that it is 'an expression of cheer' derives probably from media, and the way 'modern traditional greek fun' is depicted in movies. In practice, 'opa' (greek: ώπα) is more frequently used in modern informal everyday speech much like the expression 'oops!', and its use as an expression of cheer is rather rare in my opinion. Hope I am of help, I use the site quite a lot and I will be contributing as much as possible in my spare time. At your service for further clarifications.GoodMeteors (talk) 23:10, 19 February 2013 (UTC)

What I don't understand is why you want to spend all this effort on an English entry, when the Greek entry at ώπα has the same definition- which everyone will agree is totally wrong for that entry. In fact, if this fails verification, the English entry is going to be deleted- so your edits will disappear, anyway. If it's kept, it's likely the definition will be different than that for the Greek entry: English speakers mostly only know what they see in movies and in advertising for Greek restaurants. Their usage is bound to be based on a skewed stereotype of Greek culture- but English isn't Greek.

It's a lot like "gesundheit", which in English is nothing more than what you say when someone sneezes. In German, it's always capitalized, and means "health". A similar example is bona fide, a two-word Latin phrase meaning "in good faith", with the second word pronounced approximately like "fee day". If you pronounce it that way in English, though, most people who don't know Latin won't recognize it: the most common pronunciation (at least in the US) rhymes the second word with "fried", and runs it together as if it were spelled "bonified". The meaning is different, too: something along the lines of "real" or "genuine". Purists may disagree, but I would contend that the "bonified" pronunciation is good English- even if it's very bad Latin.

We're a descriptive dictionary, which means we document the way people actually use words and phrases, not how they should use them. The purpose of the Request For Verification page is to have people look at examples of how terms are used (or whether they are), and to verify that our entries correctly reflect that. The prevailing English usage may be ignorant and wrong regarding Greek culture, but pretending that it's something it isn't would be ignorant and wrong regarding the culture in English-speaking countries. Chuck Entz (talk) 07:59, 20 February 2013 (UTC)

The difference between gesundheit and bona fide on the one hand and opa on the other is that the former are actually used in English, and I don't believe the latter is. That's why I brought it to RFV, to see if citations can be brought forward showing that it's actually used in English. Gesundheit and bona fide are used by people who have no knowledge of German and Latin respectively; people don't even necessarily realized they're using a foreign word when they say them (which is why bona fide is so often misspelled bonified, because it's been reinterpreted as an English past participle). I just noticed the links you provided above, which are interesting in that of the three only one is used in a Greek context; one is in Lebanon and one is in Brazil. —Angr 08:42, 20 February 2013 (UTC)

My Gangnam Style reference was a joke by the way. I wonder if GoodMeteors doesn't realize that Greek here is written in Greek script, and thinks that we're missing opa, whereas it's actually at ώπα (ópa). Mglovesfun (talk) 09:53, 20 February 2013 (UTC)

It is nice to see that discussion is lively and ongoing. I understand the argument regarding the dictionary being descriptive, and how the more frequent meanings of 'ώπα' can be irrelevant here. That, of course, may result in an english speaker completely misunderstanding a person's apologies during a hypothetical minor accident while on holiday in Greece, misinterpreting them as an expression of 'cheer and good mood'. Anyway, I now see that the entry for the Greek language is also incomplete, as it is a copy of the one for the English language.GoodMeteors (talk) 11:23, 20 February 2013 (UTC)

{{look}} There aren't any citations in the entry and it is not well formatted. - -sche (discuss) 17:32, 5 July 2013 (UTC)

Sense deleted. bd2412 T 18:45, 22 August 2013 (UTC)

Greek expression

How is this missing w:en:Opa! (Greek expression), which is common even in English (unless you live nowhere near any Greek-Americans, Greek-British, etc.). — SMcCandlish [talk] [cont] ‹(-¿-)› 00:41, 4 March 2016 (UTC)