Template talk:el-noun

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face=, lang=[edit]

Does anyone mind if I edit this template for general clean-up — face=head/face=bold, lang=el, etc.? —RuakhTALK 01:15, 4 February 2010 (UTC)

sounds like this should be done —Saltmarshαπάντηση 14:21, 5 February 2010 (UTC)
O.K.; I've put what I plan to do at User:Ruakh/Template. —RuakhTALK 18:09, 5 February 2010 (UTC)
I am unable to give a considered response without spending a couple of hours sorting out the syntax - whose structure I have now forgotten - I originally put it together by trial and error :). I'm sure your changes are good. —Saltmarshαπάντηση 06:29, 6 February 2010 (UTC)
Done, thanks. :-)   Note that the changes will take a while to clear the job queue. —RuakhTALK 17:27, 8 February 2010 (UTC)


I'm seeing a lot of extra spaces before a plural, take for example Άγγλος (Ánglos). Mglovesfun (talk) 15:35, 9 September 2010 (UTC)

That was done this past Sunday, presumably intentionally, in this edit. Personally, I think it was a bad change. —RuakhTALK 00:05, 10 September 2010 (UTC)
I've removed a couple of spaces. —Saltmarshαπάντηση 05:10, 11 September 2010 (UTC)
There are still three spaces, SFAICT. Mglovesfun (talk) 12:30, 11 September 2010 (UTC)
see below. (SFAIC ?)
I've now created [[SFAICT]]. —RuakhTALK 16:36, 11 September 2010 (UTC)

Plural in the inflection line[edit]

Are there any opinions on removing the plural form once the declension is in place? —Saltmarshαπάντηση 05:11, 11 September 2010 (UTC)

Do you mean, in any given entry, once a full declension table has been added, changing {{el-noun|m|filakas|φύλακες}} to just {{el-noun|m|filakas}}? Or do you mean, overall, once declension tables are widespread, editing the template to remove support for {{{3}}}? If the former, I think that sounds reasonable; if the latter, I'm less sure. (But in either case I'm happy to defer to you.)
By the way, I've noticed that the template output looks rather different from other inflection templates. It currently looks like this:
φύλακας m (filakas)   plural: φύλακες
whereas I believe most inflection templates produce something more like this:
φύλακας (filakas) m (plural φύλακες)
with transliteration before gender, like how {{t}} does it, and with the inflections in parentheses rather than set off by spaces. I'm O.K. with this if you prefer it — for that matter, I said above that I thought the excess spaces were bad change, but again, I'm O.K. with them since you apparently prefer them — but I thought it worth mentioning. If you don't specifically prefer the current setup, then the other setup has the advantage of making the plural form a bit less obtrusive IMHO; it feels like a more "natural" part of the inflection line, I think.
RuakhTALK 12:18, 11 September 2010 (UTC)
Some years ago I suggested that we needed a page showing an ideal inflection line for all languages. We could then aim for something. At Vahag's suggestion the other day I removed the plural transliteration, they've gone - to my mind the present layout looks better - but without a house style on show I have just blundered on. The same points apply to declension/conjugation tables - we really need a house style for these - and another page of epitomes. —Saltmarshαπάντηση 15:25, 11 September 2010 (UTC)

Gender forms in the headword line[edit]

When looking at the entry for a word like δάσκαλος used not to be immediately obvious that there was a feminine form - which would be shown distantly below under Related forms. So, following the example shown in French (see auteur ) and Russian поэт) I have added these options to the template. In addition, following Ruakh's suggestion above I have placed the transliteration immediately after the headword with the gender abbreviation following this. I have not put the plural/femine forms within parenthises - the brackets seem unnecessary, and with their proximity to the transliteration brackets, clumsy.

Please comment! —Saltmarshtalk-συζήτηση 05:01, 4 August 2011 (UTC)

Common gender nouns[edit]

Holton, Mackridge and Philippaki-Warburton's Greek: A comprehensive grammar … refers to some Greek nouns has having common gender - words like γιατρός (doctor) and βουλευτής (politician) - which decline in masculine fashion, but take either masculine or feminine articles and adjectives. How do we indicate this in the headword line:

Once it is decided which is preferable suitable changes to this template will put the decision into effect. — Saltmarshαπάντηση 05:39, 11 October 2012 (UTC)

I vote m, f. --WikiTiki89 (talk) 06:37, 11 October 2012 (UTC)
I, too, would prefer m, f; it seems like c is better suited to languages that don't distinguish m from f, and only distinguish c from n. On the other hand, what do other dictionaries do? - -sche (discuss) 06:54, 11 October 2012 (UTC)
I haven't come across any that use c - older ones (Kriaras & Pocket Oxford) just use m - the newer (Bambiniotis & Collins) have "ο/η" or "m/f" or similar. — Saltmarshαπάντηση 18:09, 11 October 2012 (UTC)
m, f. I think "common" does not clarify by itself that this is not for neuter. Reader must search wiktionary explains. Also there are nouns and adjectives (the invariant ones), which are "trully" common to all three genders. --Xoristzatziki (talk) 06:55, 11 October 2012 (UTC)
m, f for the above mentioned reasons and because it's very clear; it does not need any further explanations. --flyax (talk) 10:07, 11 October 2012 (UTC)
m, f. It is clear and one does not need to know what c means. Dimboukas (talk) 17:55, 11 October 2012 (UTC)
I think we have enough "m, f" to take that as the answer - I tackle the changes. But the category for common gender nouns can continue. — Saltmarshαπάντηση 18:09, 11 October 2012 (UTC)
I just changed the entry έφηβος and it does no longer belong to the category. Can we fix that or should I add the category manually? --flyax (talk) 20:20, 11 October 2012 (UTC)
No need to add the Cat - changes to el-noun will achieve that. — Saltmarshαπάντηση 04:25, 12 October 2012 (UTC)

P.S. for Greek editors: Template {{el-l}} has been modified to display "m, f" if c is used. — Saltmarshαπάντηση 06:39, 12 October 2012 (UTC)

Polytonic forms[edit]

Polytonic forms should exist as nouns or as forms? (ex. ἐρωμένος) --Xoristzatziki (talk) 07:34, 16 July 2013 (UTC)

Invariable recategorised as Indeclinable[edit]

To follow current practice this template has been changed so that invariable nouns are recategorised as indeclinable and moved to Category:Greek indeclinable nouns. The use of "inv" in parameter#2 will continue to work, but users are encouraged to use "ind". — Saltmarsh. 12:47, 6 February 2017 (UTC)