Talk:你
I cannot see the "你" Letter, its invisible to me ...
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Rfv-sense for given Vietnamese reading, as it's uncited and not in the Unihan database. Bumm13 (talk) 13:04, 13 January 2013 (UTC)
- I've deleted the readings which did not occur in Nom, and left the ones which did occur. - -sche (discuss) 21:24, 28 June 2013 (UTC)
The following discussion has been moved from Wiktionary:Requests for cleanup (permalink).
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How is this a traditional character? Its right component 尔 is simplified from 爾. — This unsigned comment was added by Johnny Shiz (talk • contribs).
- @Johnny Shiz Many "traditional" characters have been simplified from more complex characters. Traditional characters are the characters that are generally considered to be traditional (that is, used as more or less standard characters in Taiwan, Hong Kong and Macau), regardless of whether they have been simplified before. There have been many changes over the years as the Chinese script continually evolved. 你 is generally considered to be a traditional character, as it is used in Taiwan, Hong Kong and Macau as the standard character. Any other variant of 你 is considered to be nonstandard. — justin(r)leung { (t...) | c=› } 04:52, 29 March 2016 (UTC)
- From some perspective, it is considered a simplified character (from 儞), even if it's currently used in Taiwan and other fantizi areas. For example, Japanese, Korean or Vietnamese probably didn't include it at all, as a relatively late simplification, long after the incorporation of Chinese characters into these languages was complete. This could be a reason for the question, just guessing. As a cleanup, the usage of the character in JKV languages should be verified (despite the inclusion in the Unihan dictionary, which gives CJKV reading for almost any character) and etymology/usage explained. --Anatoli T. (обсудить/вклад) 00:31, 1 April 2016 (UTC)
- It is probably simplified in the sense that it may have come from 儞, but it is also "traditional" in the sense that it is generally accepted as traditional. 儞 was probably never considered to be "standard". 集韻 considers 伲 to be the orthodox form and 儞/你 as variants. The Kangxi Dictionary didn't even include 儞, but has 伱. In 通雅, it says, "爾汝而若乃一聲之轉。爾又爲尔，尔又作伱，俗書作你。" (爾, 汝, 而, 若 are variations of the same sound. 爾 is also written as 尔; 尔 is also written as 伱, commonly written as 你.) While old dictionaries do usually consider 你 to be variant forms, 你 is almost universally accepted as traditional standard form in Chinese. I definitely agree that we need to cleanup the other languages. — justin(r)leung { (t...) | c=› } 06:59, 1 April 2016 (UTC)
- From some perspective, it is considered a simplified character (from 儞), even if it's currently used in Taiwan and other fantizi areas. For example, Japanese, Korean or Vietnamese probably didn't include it at all, as a relatively late simplification, long after the incorporation of Chinese characters into these languages was complete. This could be a reason for the question, just guessing. As a cleanup, the usage of the character in JKV languages should be verified (despite the inclusion in the Unihan dictionary, which gives CJKV reading for almost any character) and etymology/usage explained. --Anatoli T. (обсудить/вклад) 00:31, 1 April 2016 (UTC)
Discussion closed. Wyang (talk) 07:24, 23 May 2016 (UTC)