Talk:Chesterford

@Donnanz A fictional city? What's the context? Why would we include this, and does it meet WT:FICTION? Equinox ◑ 12:00, 8 February 2022 (UTC)

@Equinox: I'm not overly fussed about the fictional city, and haven't a clue whether it complies with WT:FICTION. I did come across Google references to the fictional city though. I really wanted to create a disamb page to cover Great and Little Chesterford, and their etymology. But you can delete the fiction if you like. DonnanZ (talk) 12:12, 8 February 2022 (UTC)

@Donnanz: This is probably the single weirdest RFV case I have seen. But I'm going to do it, on principle. Try not to hate me. Equinox ◑ 11:48, 21 February 2022 (UTC)

RFV discussion: February–April 2022

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Chesterford

I've been here since 2008 and this is the weirdest RFV I have seen (or created); see talk page. The point is: there are real places called "Great Chesterford" and "Little Chesterford", but "Chesterford" itself is (at least on Wiktionary) only defined as "a fictional city in Massachusetts, USA" and I guess wouldn't pass FICTION. We can probably find some fuckin' village by the name, to pass it on a technicality, and Donnanz, I really don't want to be a jerk, but this entry really made my teeth itch, as they say. Community thoughts? Equinox ◑ 11:50, 21 February 2022 (UTC)

Then you're going to love this: Chesterford was also a fictional surname in the film "The Titfield Thunderbolt". One problem is that I don't know when the "Great" and "Little" were adopted in Essex, maybe in the 19th century - I can find references to the Chesterford of Roman days on Google. And no, I can't find any other place named just "Chesterford", not even the teeniest of hamlets. DonnanZ (talk) 12:33, 21 February 2022 (UTC)

I’ve checked Open Domesday, and both lacked the prefix back then: Great Chesterford and Little Chesterford. The problem is that they’re actually recorded as Cestrefordã and Cestrefort, which isn’t particularly helpful. Theknightwho (talk) 16:42, 21 February 2022 (UTC)

We're not in the business of documenting every fictional location. I doubt this has seen three durably archived, independent uses in an out-of-universe context; but, hey, that's what RfV is for. I wasn't able to find any mentions of this location at all on Google Books, and even Twitter (linking via Nitter due to blacklist) doesn't seem to have much. If we were to pass it on a technicality, it would almost certainly have to be in reference to some other place called "Chesterford", not the setting of 211. 70.172.194.25 16:54, 21 February 2022 (UTC)

I'm not too concerned about any fictional place or surname, as long as the page can be kept for disambiguation of Great and Little Chesterford, Wikipedia doesn't oblige. Even now there is Chesterford Research Park (in Little Chesterford parish), and Chesterford House in Great Chesterford (Ordnance Survey Explorer map 209). The railway station (on the edge of Great Chesterford) was named Great Chesterford in Bradshaw by August 1887 (a reprint I have). DonnanZ (talk) 20:24, 21 February 2022 (UTC)

There is a Chesterford Road in Winchester, MA. Interesting... DonnanZ (talk) 21:51, 21 February 2022 (UTC)

Quite incredibly, despite very much sounding like it should be an actual surname, there are NO Chesterfords listed in over 26 million Commonwealth military records [1]. Overlordnat1 (talk) 21:49, 21 February 2022 (UTC)

There is also a fictional “Lord Chesterford” in E. F. Benson’s novel Dodo.^[2]  --Lambiam 23:07, 21 February 2022 (UTC)

Here are some uses of an unqualified geonym Chesterford: [3], [4], [5].  --Lambiam 23:15, 21 February 2022 (UTC)

There's quite a few streets named Chesterford this-that-and-the-other in the Master Atlas of Greater London. DonnanZ (talk) 23:33, 21 February 2022 (UTC)

Hmm, maybe I should move there so Wiktionary readers can more easily send me fan mail. So far it's all got lost in the post. This, that and the other (talk) 10:11, 22 February 2022 (UTC)

Heh, house prices in the Chesterford area (or "the Chesterfords" as found on Google) can be dearer than in London... DonnanZ (talk) 10:46, 22 February 2022 (UTC)

Your first and third link clearly refer to the main Chesterford on the Essex/Cambridgeshire border now known as Great and Little Chesterford but the claim that Chesterford is in the ‘Hastings Barony’ in the second link is a mystery to me. There’s a ‘Chesterford Road’ and ‘Chesterford Gardens’ in London on Google Maps. Overlordnat1 (talk) 00:47, 22 February 2022 (UTC)

Yes, you're right about the streets, I also included those named Chesterfield. Damned small print in the index. DonnanZ (talk) 10:00, 22 February 2022 (UTC)

I would suspect, and the citations linked above (and railway timetable mentioned in the entry, etc) seem to bear out, that any time there are reasonably-commonly-mentioned names with obvious qualifiers like "Great", the unqualified form will at least marginally occur, like with people calling either North or South Carolina "Carolina", New Jersey "Jersey", Stratford-upon-Avon "Stratford", etc. If many of the citations only refer to one Chesterford or the other, tweak "Great Chesterford and Little Chesterford" to "Great Chesterford and/or Little Chesterford". - -sche (discuss) 17:10, 27 February 2022 (UTC)

I think that is a given for neighbouring places. There's some widely separated places in England named Wellington which don't have distinguishing affixes, the same happens with Ashford (Surrey/Middlesex, and Kent). The real point of Equinox's RFV, though, is whether we should record fictional cities, and fictional surnames also should be considered - as Overlordnat1 observed (above) the use of Chesterford as a surname seems to be virtually non-existent. DonnanZ (talk) 10:49, 28 February 2022 (UTC)

RFV-failed Kiwima (talk) 21:14, 17 April 2022 (UTC)

@Kiwima: The only bit that was an RFV was the fictional city in Massachusetts. Can you restore the rest? Thankyou. DonnanZ (talk) 22:36, 17 April 2022 (UTC)

@Donnanz: That was hardly clear - if you don't want a challenge to apply to an entire entry, you should use rfv-sense. Kiwima (talk) 03:14, 18 April 2022 (UTC)

@Kiwima: I didn't create the RFV, but I take your point - I had added etymology prior to the RFV, and other stuff after Equinox slapped the RFV on it. Anyway, thanks a lot. DonnanZ (talk) 08:31, 18 April 2022 (UTC)