User talk:Irman

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Hello, Irman. Mazanderani وازیک (vâzik, sand) is a very interesting possible cognate. What is your source for it? --Vahag (talk) 22:38, 5 January 2014 (UTC)

I know a little Mazanderani, but for source you can see here [1](Irman (talk) 11:33, 6 January 2014 (UTC))
I want to advise Hrach Martirosyan, a linguist, about the existence of this word. Maybe he will need to cite it. Do you know if وازیک (vâzik, sand) is mentioned in some academic source? A book, article, dictionary? It doesn't matter, if such source is unavailable online. --Vahag (talk) 13:13, 6 January 2014 (UTC)
I don't know about published sources.(Irman (talk) 13:34, 6 January 2014 (UTC))

Martirosyan says thanks. By the way, please consider adding a Babel box to your user page. --Vahag (talk) 14:55, 6 January 2014 (UTC)


Hi. What is your source for this edit? All the sources I have say Middle Iranian *tāg “crown” is unattested. We only have Manichaean Middle Persian (not Parthian) tʾg “arch” (not “crown”). --Vahag (talk) 23:08, 15 January 2014 (UTC)

My source was from compound word "xārtāg" means "crown of thorns" in Dictionary Of Manichean Middle Persian & Parthian.(Irman (talk) 16:05, 16 January 2014 (UTC))
It is a very interesting finding, thank you. Seems that Armenologists do not know about that attestation. But still, the source doesn't say the Persian word was borrowed from Parthian. Parthian is not the ancestor of Persian, so unless there is evidence to the contrary a borrowing should not be presumed. Do you mind if I change "from Parthian..." to "compare Parhtian..."? The same for کلان and نزم. By the way, you can use the {{R:xpr:DMMPP}} template now. --Vahag (talk) 18:24, 17 January 2014 (UTC)
I completely agree with you and thank you for template.(Irman (talk) 09:04, 18 January 2014 (UTC))


سلام، واژهٔ lhw' که در اینجا ذکر کرده‌اید از چه منبعی است؟ من هرچه می‌گردم پیدا نمی‌کنم. در فارسی میانه به رخ شطرنج mādayār می‌گفتند، و طبق چیزی که من قبلاً در منابع خوانده بودم «رخ» از سانسکریت است. --Z 08:16, 16 January 2014 (UTC)

از پیوست دیکشنری مکنزی "ADDENDA ET CORRIGENDA".(Irman (talk) 16:16, 16 January 2014 (UTC))


Hi, I'd like to know the sources for the etymology of لاش (lâš) if possible. A link if it's from a site, or the impressum if it's from a book. Thanks in advance.


Hi. Did you use some source in linking پچین (pačin) with Sanskrit पादचिह्न (pādacihna)? My sources take it to Old Iranian *pati-čagnaka- without mentioning the Sanskrit word. --Vahag (talk) 20:38, 7 December 2014 (UTC)

Hi! In answer to your question I have to say that I found it from a sanskrit dictionary on the web. maybe I made a mistake, but there is another word in Parthian "pādmuhr" wich seems to me to be a translation of the Sanskrit.(Irman (talk) 06:16, 8 December 2014 (UTC))
The similarity must be accidental. I have now expanded the etymology with references. --Vahag (talk) 17:01, 8 December 2014 (UTC)


Hi, would you like to expand the short page for the term ‎نخبه‌گرا? --Lo Ximiendo (talk) 15:39, 17 December 2014 (UTC)

Also expand اشکانیان (which I found at Short Pages, as found in the Community Portal), if you can and have the time. --Lo Ximiendo (talk) 15:53, 17 December 2014 (UTC)
And کارورزی --Lo Ximiendo (talk) 16:10, 17 December 2014 (UTC)
And بنیان‌گذار --Lo Ximiendo (talk) 16:29, 17 December 2014 (UTC)
What would you like to know more about those words? they all have clear meaning.(Irman (talk) 16:54, 17 December 2014 (UTC))
You could apply the plural and the Tajik Cyrillic counterpart spelling (if applicable), if you can. --Lo Ximiendo (talk) 16:56, 17 December 2014 (UTC)
What;s the transliteration of ترک ترک? Could you also examine the transliteration of تقو? --Lo Ximiendo (talk) 10:50, 18 December 2014 (UTC)
There is no word ترک ترک in persian as I know, but it seems to be an afghan colloquialism. تقو has wrong dictation. the correct form is تقوی similar to arabic.(Irman (talk) 15:32, 18 December 2014 (UTC))


Hello, why have you removed the context label? Surely it is either archaic or obsolete? Kaixinguo (talk) 16:32, 18 December 2014 (UTC)

Because if you label such a word as obsolete or archaic you would do this on almost 80% of persian vocabulary. Persian is not a first language of most of people in Iran, Afghanistan and less in Tajikstan, so people used to speak with small vocabulary in everyday conversation through history. but educated people could understand them, if not they couldn't understand classical texts. I tried to explain it, sorry my english is not good.(Irman (talk) 19:31, 18 December 2014 (UTC))
All right, I think I understand. Your English is good :) Kaixinguo (talk) 11:15, 19 December 2014 (UTC)

Persian terms needing transliteration[edit]

I came across the term اولویت at Short Pages; if the term is real, what's the transliteration? --Lo Ximiendo (talk) 18:05, 18 December 2014 (UTC)

P.S. Here's the category. --Lo Ximiendo (talk) 18:07, 18 December 2014 (UTC)

Global account[edit]

Hi Irman! As a Steward I'm involved in the upcoming unification of all accounts organized by the Wikimedia Foundation (see m:Single User Login finalisation announcement). By looking at your account, I realized that you don't have a global account yet. In order to secure your name, I recommend you to create such account on your own by submitting your password on Special:MergeAccount and unifying your local accounts. If you have any problems with doing that or further questions, please don't hesitate to contact me on my talk page. Cheers, DerHexer (talk) 18:18, 14 January 2015 (UTC)

Alternative forms[edit]

Just so you know, this is how we format alternative forms on Wiktionary, so that all the information is located on the main lemma page. Thanks! —Μετάknowledgediscuss/deeds 16:58, 25 March 2015 (UTC)

فرنگ در سفرنامه[edit]

سلام، من نتوانستم کلمهٔ فرنگ را در سفرنامه (ناصرخسرو) پیدا کنم. کجای سفرنامه است؟ واژه به چه صورتی آمده است، خودِ فرنگ؟ --Z 13:32, 6 August 2015 (UTC)

سلام، راستش من خودم مطمئن نیستم ولی فکر می کنم در بخشی از سفرنامه که درس کتاب فارسی مدرسه بود یعنی در شرق مدیترانه اسم فرنگ آمده است . (Irman (talk) 06:02, 12 August 2015 (UTC))

من متن آن را تقریباً یادم است. واژهٔ روم به کار رفته بود (واژهٔ فرسنگ هم زیاد به کار رفته بود، شاید با آن اشتباه گرفته باشیدش). در متن سفرنامه روی اینترنت هم یک جستجو انجام دادم چنین واژه‌ای نبود. پس به همان قبلی برمی‌گردانمش. --Z 07:41, 12 August 2015 (UTC)

در سفر ناصر خسرو به طرابلس هست. (Irman (talk) 09:07, 12 August 2015 (UTC)) «...و باجگاهی است آن جا که کشتی های که از اطراف روم و فرنگ و اندلس و مغرب بیاید عشر به سلطان دهند...»

اوه بله. من متن آن بخش از سفرنامه را اتفاقاً خیلی خوب یادم بود عجیب است که به این دقت نکرده بودم. نقل قول را الان می‌افزایم --Z 16:33, 12 August 2015 (UTC)



Could you please not capitalise Persian transliterations? --Anatoli T. (обсудить/вклад) 07:30, 5 September 2016 (UTC)

Hi! although capitalisation does not exist in Perso-Arabic writing system but I think it is better to use in transliteration for whom prefers writing Persian in Latin Alphabet.(Irman (talk) 08:00, 5 September 2016 (UTC))
It has been discussed several times and it was agreed that for languages where it's not standard to capitalise transliterations, eg Japanese rōmaji on proper nouns, there should be no capitalisation. This included Persian and regular editors of Persian. Persian and Hebrew are languages where some casual editors still continue doing it. There's no point really. Standard dictionaries and textbooks don't do it either. --Anatoli T. (обсудить/вклад) 08:07, 5 September 2016 (UTC)



We're using "â" for the long "a", not "ā". As in WT:FA TR. --Anatoli T. (обсудить/вклад) 02:35, 28 November 2016 (UTC)

I prefer using "ā" instead. I think it is more appropriate for Persian transliteration and must be used in wiktionary too.(Irman (talk) 09:06, 28 November 2016 (UTC))
There are many things we do like or dislike. Burmese speakers want to call their language "Myanmar". We have to follow the established rules. If a decision is made to change â->ā, then this can be done with a bot. Don't you agree. I'm not forcing my view but if you want to change the policy, try to change it in coordination with others. :) --Anatoli T. (обсудить/вклад) 10:07, 28 November 2016 (UTC)
I will support switching to ā, in line with other Iranian languages, but Anatoli is right that this is a policy matter and should be discussed and agreed upon first. The current practice is the one shown at WT:FA TR. --Vahag (talk) 12:25, 28 November 2016 (UTC)
Thank you for your guidance.(Irman (talk) 21:06, 28 November 2016 (UTC))



Do you mind checking امتیاز and adding transliterations to the usage examples? --Anatoli T. (обсудить/вклад) 23:25, 3 December 2016 (UTC)

Done.(Irman (talk) 18:26, 5 December 2016 (UTC))

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درود. دو پرسش داشتم

  • اگر چند واژه به یک چم بودند آیا نمی‌بایست به گونه‌ای به هم ارتباط داده شوند؟ مثلا ریسیدن و تنیدن
  • اگر یک واژه به دو گونه نوشته میشد باید چه کرد؟

Ms96 (talk) 19:20, 16 March 2017 (UTC)

درود، ببخشید من منظور شما را متوجه نمی شوم
Ms96 (talk)مثلا بیختن همچنین به شکل ویختن هم نوشته می‌شود؛ باید دو صفحه جداگانه بسازیم یا در یک صفحه گفته شود این واژه به دو گونه نوشته می‌شود؟
خودم فهمیدم (: سپاس Ms96 (talk)


سلام, این واژه الف ندارد یا اینکه اشتباهی شده است؟ خواستم مطمئن شوم: [2] --Z 12:51, 23 May 2017 (UTC)

سلام، راستش خودم مطمئن نیستم ولی فکر کنم برگرفته از شیوه نگارش کتیبه ای باشد که الف را نمی نوشتند. شاید هم بشود آنرا فرهت خواند. بهر حال نام مشهوری است و احتمالاً همین درست است. (Irman (talk) 13:03, 23 May 2017 (UTC))
بله در پارتی نبود الف قبل از نون پایانی که کاملا رایج است. من فقط خواستم مطمئن شود در منبعتان هم به همین گونه آمده است. --Z 13:14, 23 May 2017 (UTC)

منبع برای سار[edit]

سلام. می‌توانید منبع این را همانجا ذکر کنید؟ فرهنگ معین سار را به معنی شتر آورده است اما نقل قولی ذکر نکرده. البته دهخدا هم چنین معنی‌ای برای سار نیاورده است. --Z 08:53, 8 September 2017 (UTC)

سلام. من این معنی را خودم از ریشه تاریخی و جغرافیایی آن استنباط کردم. همانطور که اشاره کردید سار به معنی شتر اصلا در فارسی وجود نداشت پس طبیعتاً ساربان هم شتربان نمیشود و مشخص میشود که این معنی را فرهنگ نویسان از خود ابداع کردند. سار میتواند مخفف یا گونه از تلفظ سارت باشد. در ضمن هنوز در ازبکستان به غیر ترکها سارت می گویند که باید از زبان سغدی به جا مانده باشد.(Irman (talk) 09:11, 8 September 2017 (UTC))
البته معنای «شتربان» برای ساربان جاافتاده است و در نقل قولی که الان از بیهقی اضافه کردم به نظرم فقط معنی شتربان می‌تواند بدهد. ممکن است معنی شتربان از معنای سرپرست کاروان مبدل شده باشد. --Z 09:32, 8 September 2017 (UTC)
درست می فرمائید. به نظر میاید که معنی آن در گذر زمان تغییر کرده بوده باشد. احتمالاً به این خاطر که جز اول آن معنی اش فراموش شده بود.(Irman (talk) 09:45, 8 September 2017 (UTC))


Hey, thanks for adding the transliterations, could you join the discussion at Etymology_scriptorium, there seem to be some indications that this word is of Arabic origin, could you defend (through arguments or sources) the claim of native Iranian origin? Crom daba (talk) 22:12, 25 December 2017 (UTC)


سلام I started a thread about a page you created[3]. I found the spelling تیراﮋه in this dictionary. So I think it would be inaccurate to say تیراﮋه is a misspelling. I went ahead and made this change.[4] Please let me know if I did something incorrect. از کار شما اینجا خیلی متشکرم. Biosthmors (talk) 14:30, 5 February 2018 (UTC)

Hi, Sorry for answering late! That is an obsolete word in Persian and I discovered that it had been recorded wrong in lexicons because of misreading of copiers so I correct it here for the fist time in the history of Persian language! (Irman (talk) 20:32, 23 February 2018 (UTC))


Irman, if you're going to cite proto forms, you need to provide sources. Case in point, سخش, which strikes me as quite dubious, both morphologically and semantically. --Victar (talk) 18:43, 23 February 2018 (UTC)

You are right! I am an experimental linguist :-) Thank you for correcting my mistake! (Irman (talk) 20:14, 23 February 2018 (UTC))
what is your opinion on this word حاخشوک, I've restored it from جاخشوک.(Irman (talk) 20:51, 23 February 2018 (UTC))
Source added. --Victar (talk) 21:35, 23 February 2018 (UTC)
But that is semantically farther than what I had written there! seg- could be a etymological root for هاچه (hâče, prop)(Irman (talk) 21:50, 23 February 2018 (UTC))
I recommend you read the source. Many reconstructions are possible, which is why you need older forms and cognates. --Victar (talk) 22:07, 23 February 2018 (UTC)
I added my hypothesis again with yours as another possibility. (Irman (talk) 22:12, 23 February 2018 (UTC))
I didn't think I would have to say this again, but please do not add proto etymologies without sources. --Victar (talk) 22:15, 23 February 2018 (UTC)

Irman, please desist from adding spurious proto etymologies with no sources. They will be deleted. --Victar (talk) 13:49, 24 February 2018 (UTC)

How do you allow yourself to delete my writings?! Get out of my page!(Irman (talk) 16:07, 24 February 2018 (UTC))

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Capitalisation of romanisations[edit]

Hello Irman, please could you add your opinion at as you are the only person with significant edits who hasn't offered an opinion. Thank you. Kaixinguo~enwiktionary (talk) 10:52, 12 April 2018 (UTC)

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