User talk:Etimo

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term template[edit]

I notice you're using the {{term}} to add Albanian etymologies. No problem with that- but I also notice you're using "lang=la". "la" is the language code for Latin, which means that any link it creates to an existing page will take you to the Latin section. I think you want to use "lang=sq" instead (there are also codes specific to subcategories of Albanian- see WT:LANGLIST). Chuck Entz (talk) 07:22, 30 May 2012 (UTC)



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Again, welcome!

Please also consider putting a BabelBox on your userpgae so we know what languages you're familiar with. Thanks --Μετάknowledgediscuss/deeds 18:58, 14 June 2012 (UTC)

Glosses of Albanian terms[edit]

Hi Etimo, when you add English glosses to Albanian terms (or terms in any non-English language), please link the glosses individually. See here for an example. It should be obvious that Wiktionary doesn't have entries like [[arrow, bolt]] but rather two separate entries [[arrow]] and [[bolt]]. Thanks! —Angr 16:01, 31 January 2013 (UTC)

Hi, you're right, just noticed the mistake. Thanks for the tip!

Albanian etymologies[edit]

I noticed you copied a significant part of the etymology of borë from [1]. Do you have permission to directly copy from this source? DTLHS (talk) 19:45, 5 February 2013 (UTC)

I just copied the authors notes providing the quote, I thought their opinion could enrich the accuracy of the terms's etymo. No, I didn't ask them for permission. Should I delete them?(Etimo (talk) 19:56, 5 February 2013 (UTC))

Generally we don't allow direct copying from any source. If you rewrote them slightly to be more in line with Wiktionary formatting they would be fine. Also consider adding a direct link to that source. DTLHS (talk) 20:11, 5 February 2013 (UTC)

Language codes[edit]

Language codes are not to be used at random; they categorise entries and sq must be used for Albanian, en for English, and - when you are just comparing one term to another (more documentation can be found at {{etyl}}). Please see these changes as an example. —Μετάknowledgediscuss/deeds 03:13, 7 February 2013 (UTC)

I think I just overlooked it, guess I must pay more attention. Thanks for the tip! One question, I noticed that my posts are constantly being notified by some users because of an incorrect space layout (i.e. "spaces after header"), although I think I'm creating them after Wiki' standards used in all posts. Since I don't get where the problem lies, could you please tell me what I'm doing wrong? Thanks.Etimo (talk) 12:40, 7 February 2013 (UTC)

I don't know what you mean. Could you give an example? —Μετάknowledgediscuss/deeds 14:37, 7 February 2013 (UTC)

For instance, in almost all my entries the user KassadBot writes (rm spaces after header), which I assume this means he's telling me to correct the space layout of my entries. If not, what does this mean? Etimo (talk) 14:46, 7 February 2013 (UTC)

KassadBot is a robot, not a human user. You don't need to worry about that, it's just a minor layout detail which the robot will automatically correct. —Μετάknowledgediscuss/deeds 01:38, 8 February 2013 (UTC)

Lol, all right then. Thanks! Etimo (talk) 11:15, 8 February 2013 (UTC)

Please be more careful[edit]

Kalb and kalb are different. Please be much more careful when editing, because I find that I have to clean up after you. Make sure you spell things correctly (exaggeration has two g's) and just take more care in general. Thank you. —Μετάknowledgediscuss/deeds 20:02, 11 February 2013 (UTC)

Right, it just directed me automatically to Kalb therefore I thought it was not case sensitive. It's already happened before, there's still a lot of tricks I don't know about Wiki. I will double-check my contributions Etimo (talk) 20:16, 11 February 2013 (UTC)

Thank you! —Μετάknowledgediscuss/deeds 20:23, 11 February 2013 (UTC)

Second sense of grifshë[edit]

Do you know which lexicon that word is? To get an idea, have a look at Category:Albanian lexicons. --Lo Ximiendo (talk) 03:02, 14 February 2013 (UTC)

I don't think we have to list it under any particular class, it is just a common word, like shtrigë. Concerning the exact meaning, it is still unclear to me to which kind of vulture this word refers to, considering that the term has been originated to denote a mythical creature. Perhaps common vulture?? Etimo (talk) 14:14, 14 February 2013 (UTC)
I mean "A contentious and loose-lipped woman." What's the lexicon for that sense? --Lo Ximiendo (talk) 15:42, 14 February 2013 (UTC)

Slangy I guess, same as "chatty, blabbermouth, gossipy" etc. Etimo (talk) 12:00, 15 February 2013 (UTC)


Could anyone tell me how to differentiate an entry with a capital letter from a non-capitalised one? (e.g. I'd like to create "brenda" but I'm automatically redirected to "Brenda"). Thank you! Etimo (talk) 12:00, 15 February 2013 (UTC)

Maybe make a red link out of it? (brenda) --Lo Ximiendo (talk) 13:22, 15 February 2013 (UTC)

Hello, I'd like to bring to your attention an issue about which I seek your advise. My contributions to the Albanian language are beeing deleted by the user Torvalu4. I generally don't mind when this happens because this is Wiki's democratic way of sharing knowledge, the problem is that the new entries seem to be abitrary and without a clear etymological explanation. My contributions find support in the works of Demiraj, Pokorny, Jokl, Orel, Lubotsky (to mention a few), while Torvlu4 etymologies have a clear tendency to derive most of Albanian lexicon from Slavic or Latin or other sources (without giving a satisfactory explanation to it) as he carefully deletes alternative proposed etymologies (from the above mentioned authors or not), apparently leaving only the one who suits him/her. I don't want to think he/she's biased, or start a useless tag war which would take us nowhere, therefore I'd like to hear other people's opinion on the matter. Thank you Etimo (talk) 12:44, 21 February 2013 (UTC)

Try posting this message on the talk page of an administrator in case they haven't taken notice of the current issue. --Robbie SWE (talk) 20:46, 21 February 2013 (UTC)
This has been an ongoing problem, and I'm not really sure how to resolve it, because administrators like me don't have the expertise to judge who best to trust in each case. Etimo, can you please provide specific examples of etymologies that Torvalu4 removed? —Μετάknowledgediscuss/deeds 23:39, 21 February 2013 (UTC)

Thanks for your replies. I noticed that the etymos he deletes are especially those of words that find a connection or could stem from Paleo-Balcanic languages such as Thracian, Dacian, Illyrian, be of substratum nature parallel with Romanian or may derive from other Balkanic sources, as the common sense would suggest considering the origin of the language. Here are few examples: bollë, buall, bërtas (keep deleting it), daltë, krah (keep deleting it), preh, vapë, gati, gropë, frikë, kodër, urth (etymology of Demiraj, Lubotzky and de Vaan, deleted) among others, belonging to the basic lexicon which he arbitrarily describes as loanwords from other languages (especially Slavic, without explaining why), despite they have been phonetically and morphologically analysed and described as Albanian. I can't tell you which one to believe, or if it is the case here to go further into details, but I am an Albanian mother language speaker, therefore I have a clear and deep knowledge of the language and its etymologies. I don't know whether this user is also an Albanian speaker, although I highly doubt that. Etimo (talk) 01:11, 22 February 2013 (UTC)

Hmm... many of these are about PIE reflexes, it appears, so I'll notify an admin with PIE knowledge. I personally can't judge on a page like urth or bërtas; Torvalu4 gives phonological reasons in his edit summaries, but I don't know how accurate they are. —Μετάknowledgediscuss/deeds 01:29, 22 February 2013 (UTC)

The thing is that ivy in Albanian is not "hurdhe" but just "urth", while there is "hurdhe" meaning pond and garlic (with methatesized form "hudher", here the Albanian academic dictionary In Demiraj there is no trace of "hurdhe" as "ivy" but just "urth". I don't understand where he got that. Bërtas (Gheg bartit/as) is phonologically equal to Lithuanian bàrti-to scold, chide, and Old Church Slavic brati-fight. How does he explain the Albanian schwa 'ə' stemming from Slavic u?? Based on mere similarity? Etimo (talk) 01:41, 22 February 2013 (UTC)

Unfortunately, Torvalu4 relies on similarities (morphological or semantic) quite often. He/she did this all the time with Romanian words, opting for an Albanian origin if they shared the slightest resemblance. When confronted (I noticed that many edits were incorrect, especially in his/her earliest contributions where Romanian words were spelled using accents which don't exist in Romanian), he/she refused to answer any question about their knowledge of the Romanian language. --Robbie SWE (talk) 18:57, 22 February 2013 (UTC)


Hi Etimo,

I have a question concerning the origin of the abovementioned word.

Isn't "dudë" from - or possibly cognate with - the Turkish dut ("mulberry")? It exists in Romanian as well in the form of dudă; from dud ("mulberry tree") + suffix .

Best Regards, --Robbie SWE (talk) 11:37, 23 February 2013 (UTC)

The word is clearly Indoeuropean and could be a Paleo-Balkanic substratum word. This is not suprising as in Turkish there are a lot terms of Indoeuropean origin (both from old Anatolian and European languages). This might be one of those (few) words that entered in Turkish from Albanian (like: besë> T.besa, atë> T.ata, mbush, bosh> T.boš, mbyll, boll> T.bol, rraft, rrafsh > T.raf (slavic ravnij-plain) etc) or from another European source. Of course this is just my personal opinion. Etimo (talk) 12:14, 23 February 2013 (UTC)

Hmm, I see what you mean. However, Turkish etymologists derive it from Persian توت (tut), which might be of Aramaic origin תותא (tuta), with the same meaning. It's kind of farfetched that the word would have passed from Albanian to Turkish and beyond, I'm afraid. --Robbie SWE (talk) 12:31, 23 February 2013 (UTC)

I understand what you mean, I think you're right on the Albanian-Turkish loan part (considering the spread of the word), although there is no doubt that the word is Indoeuropean (in Pokorny you find the same idea). I will edit the term again though. Thanks for your useful tip. Regards Etimo (talk) 12:54, 23 February 2013 (UTC)


The "Variants" heading is not one we use. Also we do not place such things where you place them.

Please use the (L3) heading "Alternative forms" which should go immediately after the language (L2) header "Albanian".

For more on format see WT:ELE. Thanks for your efforts. Happy editing! DCDuring TALK 22:46, 26 February 2013 (UTC)

See Category:Entries_with_non-standard_headers, under "V" for the offending entries that you may have contributed and need fixing. I "fixed" a few but if I know no Albanian so I have have missed something. DCDuring TALK 22:50, 26 February 2013 (UTC)

Hi there, thanks for the tips. I'll go through my entries again and fix things after the template you just showed me. Best regards Etimo (talk) 23:03, 26 February 2013 (UTC)

Ancient Greek "λαλέω"[edit]


do you think there's a cognate for the Ancient Greek word λαλέω (laléō, to talk) in Albanian?

I also have another question concerning Albanian, if you form the imperative of "vazhdoj", can you say "vazhdo shruan" ('you shall continue writing'), and then, is it possible to say "vazhdo punojmë" ('we shall continue working')?

And another question, can "të" in Albanian be dropped, as example: "Nesë do thosha"?

Thank you for your answers!

Greetings HeliosX (talk) 20:49, 26 May 2013 (UTC)


1) I think the Albanian cognate of the Greek verb is the ethnonym "Lalë", which describe the inhabitants of the Albanian region "Myseqe" and their dialect, as well as a relative or a kin (after a common Indoeuropean feature to name tribes after the verb "to speak, to utter").

2) The imperative "you shall continue writing" or "keep writing" is "vazhdo shkruaj" (in Standard Albanian), as in Albanian both verbs have to be translated in the same grammatical number. For this reason "we shall continue working" is translated "vazhdojmë të punojmë" (or more commonly "vazhdojmë punën" - we shall continue the work).

3) Yes it can. Mind that "të", in addition to having a function similar to English "to" (as in "Po shkoj laj.. - I'm going to wash...), also means "to you", thus "Nëse do të thosha" also means "if I told you". Telling the difference (as well as choosing to write it or not) depends on the verb's aspect and on context.


Regards Etimo (talk) 00:59, 27 May 2013 (UTC)


Is this really a proper nouns meaning "that who lives, thrives"? That looks more like etymology to me. Mglovesfun (talk) 10:53, 18 June 2013 (UTC)

Hi there,

What do you mean?? Etimo (talk) 10:55, 18 June 2013 (UTC)

  • "that who lives, thrives" is not a proper noun - it looks like an explanation of what the name means. SemperBlotto (talk) 10:59, 18 June 2013 (UTC)

Every name I'm adding goes with the explanation of what the name means, in case it has one. The majority of Albanian names are compound of words which mean something specific, and since this is an etymological dictionary I judge it is the case to add such information. Unless I'm not doing it correctly after the template.......Etimo (talk) 11:05, 18 June 2013 (UTC)

That sort of thing goes under the ===Etymology=== header. Mglovesfun (talk) 11:10, 18 June 2013 (UTC)


Hi! Etymology of theks that you created is being discussed here, so perhaps you could provide some input. Cheers. --Ivan Štambuk (talk) 23:08, 6 July 2013 (UTC)

Song translation[edit]


I've translated Selena Gomez' song "A Year Without Rain" into Albanian, but I'm not really sure whether it's right, could you help me?

Një Vit Pa Shi:
Më mund të ndjen
Kur nga ti mendoj
Me çdo frymë atë marr
Çdo minutë
Çfarëdo unë bej
Botë ime është një vend bosh
Si do brodha në një shkretetirë
Për njëmijë ditë
S’di nëse ky është një mirazh
Por gjithmonë shoh fytyrë tënd, bebe
Më merr me malli për të
E s’mund shndërroj
Një ditë pa të është si një vit pa shi
Nevojit të në anë tim
S’di si mbijetoj
Yje degjen
Zë tënd dëgjoj në mendje tim
S’mund ti më degjon therras
Zëmer ime bërtas si oqean ai than
Më kap, unë bie
Ky është si dheu thërrmon ndën këmbe e mi
Nuk më do t'kursen
Andej do t’është një monsunet
Kur ti do t'rikkthen
Më merr me malli për të
E s’mund shndërroj
Një ditë pa të është si një vit pa shi
Nevojit të në anë tim
S’di si mbijetoj
Tani lejo këtë thatësirë gjen një fund
Dhe prodho këtë shkretetirë lulëzon përsëri
E të nevojit këtej
S’mund sqaroj
Por një ditë pa të
Është si një vit pa shi
Më merr me malli për të
E s’mund shndërroj
Një ditë pa të është si një vit pa shi
Nevojit të në anë tim
S’di si mbijetoj

I know this is very much text, but I'd just like to know, what could be bettered.

Greetings HeliosX (talk) 19:28, 20 August 2013 (UTC)


Considering the fact that I don't know this song, the correction I made for you are purely grammatical according to standard Albanian, and do not consider dialectal forms or expressions. Corrections or adds are in brackets next to the word or phrase I changed. Cheers Etimo (talk) 23:52, 20 August 2013 (UTC)

Më mund të ndjen ('Mund të më ndjesh' or 'Më ndjen')
Kur nga ti mendoj ('Kur ty mendoj' or 'kur mendoj për ty')
Me çdo frymë atë (që) marr
Çdo minutë
Çfarëdo unë bej ('Çfarëdo të bej' or 'Çfarëdo gjë unë bej')
Botë (Bota) ime është një vend bosh
Si do brodha në një shkretetirë ('Sikur kam bredhur nëpër shkretëtirë' or 'Sikur të kem bredhur nëpër shkretëtirë')
Për njëmijë ditë
S’di nëse ky është një mirazh
Por gjithmonë shoh fytyrë(n) tënd(e), bebe (means 'child, little baby', find another word)
Më merr me malli për të (Më merr malli për ty)
E s’mund (të) shndërroj (I can't change/transform??)
Një ditë pa të (ty) është si një vit pa shi
Nevojit të në anë tim ('kam nevoj për ty në krahun tim')
S’di si (të) mbijetoj
Yje degjen ('Yjet digjen' or 'Yjet po digjen', present continuous)
Zë(rin) tënd dëgjoj në mendje(n) tim(e)
S’mund(esh) ti (të) më degjon (dëgjosh) (kur të) therras
Zëmer (Zemra) ime bërtas (bërtet) si oqean(i) (që) than (thahet)
Më kap, unë bie (or 'unë po bie', present continuous)
Ky është (është sikur') dheu thërrmon (thërmohet) ndën (or 'nën', 'ndën' is dialectal) këmb(ët) e mi
Nuk më do t'kursen ('Nuk do më shpëtosh', 'kursej' means mainly spare money or material goods)
Andej do t’është një monsunet ('Do të fryj një monson kur ti do kthehesh tek mua', 'andej' means on that side, on that way)
Kur ti do t'rikkthen

Tani lejo këtë thatësirë (të) gjen (gjej) një fund (or,'Tani lejo që kësaj thatësire ti vij fundi')
Dhe prodho këtë shkretetirë lulëzon përsëri ('dhe bëj këtë shkretëtirë të lulëzoj përsëri')
E të nevojit këtej
S’mund (të) sqaroj
Por një ditë pa të (ty)
Është si një vit pa shi


Hi. I just wanted to point out that you emptied përrua today. I assume that you did not intend to do it. The page has now been restored. —Stephen (Talk) 11:52, 9 October 2013 (UTC)

Hi, thank you for the reminder. I was trying to edit only the Etymology section and Alternative forms. How should I proceed in order not to empty the entire page? thanks Etimo (talk) 12:03, 9 October 2013 (UTC)

I don’t understand what you are doing wrong. If you only want to edit the Etymology, you will see a blue [edit] to the right of the title Etymology. Click on that [edit] button and only the Etymology section will be opened. Make a change that you want. For example, add the word TESTING somewhere in the etymology. Then down at the bottom of your screen, click on SHOW PREVIEW. Then you should see the etymology along with the word TESTING that you added. Now, if you click SAVE at the bottom of your screen, it will save the etymology section with the word TESTING that you added.
Then, you can click on the [edit] button after the title Etymology again and removed the word TESTING, then click on PREVIEW, then SAVE, and your edit will be removed, but the etymology will still be there. Or you can click on the HISTORY tab at the top of your screen, then click on the version of the page that precedes your last edit, open it and save it ... that restores the previous version of the page. Or, you can click on the HISTORY tab at the top of your screen, and you should be able to see the buttons [rollback 1 edit] or [undo] at the end of the line where you edited the page. You can click on [rollback 1 edit] or [undo] to revert your edit to the previous version. —Stephen (Talk) 12:26, 9 October 2013 (UTC)

After some attempts with the same results as before, it finally worked. I still haven't figured out where the problem lies. I'm sure it could come up again. Thanks for your kind support Etimo (talk) 12:54, 9 October 2013 (UTC)

Reference Templates, etc.[edit]

You could inquire Pereru (talkcontribs) about what he did with the Latvian language when it comes to etymologies (and possibly Angr (talkcontribs) when it comes to diminutive forms of nouns, too.) --Lo Ximiendo (talk) 19:28, 20 October 2013 (UTC)

Hi, I don't know if I understand you right, are you talking about the templates? Because I'm following the standard template, please point out possible mistakes I'm doing..thanks! Etimo (talk) 18:29, 21 October 2013 (UTC)

You could alsi learn about the Lua programming code at any time. --Lo Ximiendo (talk) 18:32, 21 October 2013 (UTC)
I have created {{R:sq:Orel:2000}}. You can use it like this. --Vahag (talk) 21:15, 27 October 2013 (UTC)


Please note the following changes. el is for Modern Greek; you meant Ancient Greek there, grc. You do not to put [[Category:Albanian nouns]], {{sq-noun}} already does that. --Vahag (talk) 21:19, 27 October 2013 (UTC)

Moreover, {{recons}} should not be used, it is deprecated; use {{term}} and don't forget to put the glosses inside {{term}} as the third parameter. Armenian is written in the Armenian script. If you type {{term|tr=vaṙim|lang=hy}}, I will find it and provide the script. --Vahag (talk) 21:25, 27 October 2013 (UTC)

Hi, thanks for your kind instructions, I'll stick to them. One question: if I don't find a word written in its own writing system, should I just put the transliteration, and the system will automatically provide the correct writing, or shouldn't I put the term at all? Thanks Etimo (talk) 08:24, 28 October 2013 (UTC)
You should just put the transliteration like this {{term|tr=vaṙim|lang=hy}}. The system will not provide the correct writing but it will place the page into Category:Armenian terms needing native script. Then someone like me will find it and provide script. --Vahag (talk) 08:38, 28 October 2013 (UTC)


Hi. Did you intend to empty çok so that it would be deleted? I was going to delete it, but I thought I should ask if that is what you intended. —Stephen (Talk) 01:25, 30 October 2013 (UTC)

Hi, no I just wanted to edit it, the deletion was not intentional. Thank you Etimo (talk) 01:33, 30 October 2013 (UTC)


For your etymologies you reference print Pokorny (1959). But many of the Albanian words you add this reference to, e.g. gaboj, do not refer to the Albanian word at all. So, you are misrepresenting a source. I think you are using the online version prepared by in 2007. Accordingly, you need to use {{R:ine:IEW:2007}}. --Vahag (talk) 09:10, 22 November 2013 (UTC)

Hi, you're absolutely right, I thought the online version was a photocopy of the original. I'll stick to the form you showed me. Regards Etimo (talk) 12:31, 22 November 2013 (UTC)

Latin to Albanian[edit]

Hello Etimo,
I got some questions concerning the phonetic developement of the Latin words in Albanian.
What happened with the suffixes "-tio" and "-cia"?
And what happened with the consonantal clusters "ct", "pt", "gn" and "mn"?
I'd be very glad if you could help me with that.
I wish you a happy new year ;).
Greets HeliosX (talk) 16:07, 28 December 2013 (UTC)
Some of them I now found out by myself:
"ct" --> "t"
"gn" --> "nj"
"mn" --> "m"
But do you know what happend with "pt", "-tio" and "-cia"?
Greets HeliosX (talk) 00:55, 1 January 2014 (UTC)


Latin pt is rendered just as t in Albanian since labials and velars are generally dropped in clusters with t, same as in PIE inherited words. Final velars and dentals are never dropped, so you would have t for -tio and k for -cia.


Etimo (talk) 21:22, 1 January 2014 (UTC)



Could you fix the missing definition in the entry you have created, please? See this diff and Wiktionary:Tea_room/2014/January#dot_.28Albanian.29. --Anatoli (обсудить/вклад) 01:09, 21 January 2014 (UTC)


What sense of English pimp does this translate as? DCDuring TALK 20:32, 25 January 2014 (UTC)

Oops, I meant to write pimple, sorry!Etimo (talk) 14:13, 27 January 2014 (UTC)

Global account[edit]

Hi Etimo! As a Steward I'm involved in the upcoming unification of all accounts organized by the Wikimedia Foundation (see m:Single User Login finalisation announcement). By looking at your account, I realized that you don't have a global account yet. In order to secure your name, I recommend you to create such account on your own by submitting your password on Special:MergeAccount and unifying your local accounts. If you have any problems with doing that or further questions, please don't hesitate to contact me on my talk page. Cheers, DerHexer (talk) 18:14, 14 January 2015 (UTC)

Hi, thanks for your message. I tried to go through the unification process but I hit a snag. I don't know what went wrong but it just won't allow me to unify my accounts as the page popping up shows other accounts with the nickname Etimo, which are not mine (Spanish etc). Are you able to tell me what I'm doing wrong? Thanks Etimo (talk) 19:27, 1 February 2015 (UTC)


Hi, you added this word, but when we search fro mbrëmë (french keyboard), the word is not referenced, it's seem you use cyrillic "yo" character for the "ё", why ? Why do you not use standard Latin script "ë" ? Mangêzd (talk) 11:26, 3 June 2015 (UTC)

Deleted. Copied to mbrëmë. —Stephen (Talk) 22:35, 3 June 2015 (UTC)
The character ё is being regularly used. Please be more specific. Etimo (talk) 17:22, 4 June 2015 (UTC)

Mir‑dita, Etimo, no the character is not used in Latin‑Script, I don't under‑stand why you using it in Albanian word using Latin‑Script, if you want Ë or ë use Unicode character U+00CB & U+00EB, and not Cyrillic script one "yo" : Ё U+0401 & ё U+0451... I doesn't mater if you say that is regularly used (only by Russia, Belarusia & Tajikistan), first tell me by who, and two, I never eard that be‑fore ??? No, the Albanian use Latin‑script so no need to use Cyrillic letter for some Albanian Latin‑script word, this ad‑d (mbrёmё) was re‑moved by ad‑mini‑strator, also others words in future using some Cyrillic letter in‑stead of Latin in Albanian Latin‑script word, would be re‑moved to... The peoples seeking de‑finition in the "search button" use a standard Latin key‑board, with Cyrillic letter in your ad‑d we can't find the word in search, don't use it any‑more it's use‑less. Mangêzd (talk) 18:26, 4 June 2015 (UTC)

@Etimo mbrёmё was the original entry. It was spelled with ё, a Cyrillic letter. The entry has now been copied to mbrëmë (spelled with Roman ë), and the original mbrёmё has been deleted. —Stephen (Talk) 02:37, 5 June 2015 (UTC)

When I create an entry that has an ë I type it straight from the Latin script in the special character..I really don't know why the problem occurs! Etimo (talk) 20:43, 8 June 2015 (UTC)


Hi, I want to ask you why you give de‑finition night (nätë) & evening (mbrëmje / mrãmje) to darkë ? At Skopje and Kosovo, this word don't have that meaning.

  • In "Fialuur i voghel Sccyp e ltinisct (Small Dictionary of Albanian and Latin), page 21, by P. Jak Junkut, 1895, Sckoder" the word have the only meaning of "CENA".
  • In "Dictionnaire Français-Albanais / Fjalor Shqip-Frengjisht, page 444, Vedat Kokona, Tiranë, 2002, ISBN 99927-726-4-6" this word has not that under‑standing ("night" or "evening"). Vedat Kokona give also the meaning "Réveillon" (Eve of Christ‑mas or New Year, feast), that I'm gonna add.
  • In "Flajor i gjuhës së sotme shqipës", they write "koha pasi perëndon dielli; mbrëmje, vakt darkës" ; "time after the sun goes down; evening, time for dinner" ; they write evening (mbrëmje) not night (natë)...

So can you cor‑rect it ? Mangêzd (talk) 08:16, 4 June 2015 (UTC)

Hi there, you're right, night is not one of the meanings, while evening is. Thanks for your remark.Etimo (talk) 17:19, 4 June 2015 (UTC)


What form of the verb is this? Can you please modify the entry's definition to what inflection this really is? Thanks! :) NativeCat drop by and say Hi! 06:50, 5 June 2015 (UTC)

Imperfect, 3rd person plural, it denotes an action done repeatedly in the past (they left/used to leave), it is rendered in English with the preterite.Etimo (talk) 20:33, 8 June 2015 (UTC)


Mir‑dita / Hi, I ad‑ded the phonetic for Gheg & Tosk variant, I use [k] for Tosk be‑cause this sound come from the front of the mouth, and [q] for Gheg be‑cause in this dia‑lect the sound come from the back of palate (soft), us Shqyptar Gheg we use Ϙ ق [q] & Κ ك [k], but lot of peoples can't make the dif‑ference.

Here are some example :

  • kurban from arabic قربان & קרבן [qurban]
  • ket/Krejt (all) [qet/qrejt] & kêt (this) [kɛt].

I'm living in Belgium, and here they use the French sound [k] only so I can make the dif‑ference with the Gheg K [q] sound of my languages & dialects from Skopje (father) & Kosovo (mother). Be‑cause I have learn Arabic, I can make the dif‑ference be‑tween these two sound [k] & [q]. The sound K of Gheg Shqyptar look more like [q]. The pro‑blem & error come from Greek alpha‑beta, be‑cause they re‑moved the letter Koppa Ϙ and us, Shqyptart, we loosed that letter in our alpha‑beta, we have a Q but we read it [c, ɕ] and in our land K can be readed [k & q] be‑cause words from Turkish or Arabic (using Ϙ/ق) that we have in Shqyp and in Shkup are writed only with letter K that which there‑fore have two value [k] & [q]. We need to dis‑tinguish these two letters & sounds.

I also ad‑ded dif‑ferent vowels since in Gheg the A of Kalb is pro‑nounced [ɒ]...

Mangêzd (talk) 07:30, 6 June 2015 (UTC)

Hi, Tosk k is not automatically Gheg q for all words, most of the cases they are spelled k the same, Tosk kalb is the same in Gheg kalb..there are cases of k-q parallelism though, but they have to be analysed separately. Loanwords from Turkish (also Arabic words) beginning with k are rendered q in Albanian (koefte-qofte, kebab-qebab etc). The further palatalization of q into ç is a Gheg phenomenon and has nothing to do with Greek (or Turkish or Arabic for that matter)! Etimo (talk) 20:31, 8 June 2015 (UTC)

I don't say that K is auto‑matically a [q] in Gheg but in some case the Ghegs pro‑nounce the K from the back of the palate, and is a [q], this sound ex‑ist like the nasal that Tosk don't use... I agree with you that lot of Arabic / Turkish word using K [k] & Q [q] are trans‑formed to [c] but no all of them, but for me that is not normal, and those (a‑theist writers) who made these falsi‑fications just want to di‑vide the mu‑slims from under‑standing each others by con‑fusing their common words (lot of words from the Ottoman era (Arabic, Altaic & Persian) that we still use in Macedonia & Kosova are not in the standard Albanian dictionary and were re‑moved during com‑munist time, but in that sup‑posed Illyrian root based dictionary you can find lot of new ad‑ded words from "Greek / Ortho‑dox" & "Latin / Cath‑olic", why this hypo‑crisy against the i‑slamic culture ? Why to re‑ject it in our language)... I also noticed that in Tosk the Gheg P is often changed to MB, in mod‑ern Greek ΜΠ is [b], it seem that the Shqiptar Orthodox (from the south of Albania & north of Greece) have chosen to make P [p] to ΜΜΠ/ΜΒ [mb] (pruj mbroj (rujtar) ; prapa mbrapa ; prãmë mbrëmë ; shtremoj shtrembëroj). The Toskërisht change :

  • K to NG (kadal ngadal ; ka nga)
  • G to NG (garkoj ngarkoj from carr‧us)
  • K [k/q] to Q [c] (käjt Qajt ; kenef qenef ; koft qoft ; kebap qebap)
  • M to MB (mas mbas ; myt mbyt ; mrãm‧je mbrëm‧je)
  • P to MB (pruj mbroj ; prãm mbrëm‧ë ; mbret from im‑per‧at‧or)
  • N to ND (nër ndër ; ner‧oj nder‧oj ; kn‧oj kënd‧oj ; shn‧et shënd‧et from sanitas ; as‑doni‑here as‑ndonjë‑here)
  • Ë is added at the end of lot of words or in middle (kput këput ; Zot Zotë ; ms‧oj mës‧oj ; burr burrë) in French Ë [ə] (euh [œ ə ʌ] is the sound that they make when they don't know some‑thing, for me it is the sound of cow, the sound of dumb‑ness, that the Standard/Tosks heavily uses, the Ghegs don't use it much, but Ghegs uses the nazal à [ɑ̃] sound of the mule / ass, animal who generally is very stubborn, ob‑stinate & ob‑durate...
  • ‑VE to ‑ËVE (aristo‑kratikve aristo‑kratikëve)
  • UN/ËN to UR (pasuni pasuri ; rujtën rujtun rujtur ; dashuri dashuni ; rrezitun rrezitur ; ‑UR is fire in Latin [[uro#LATIN[UR‧Ô]] (UaRWaRgUaRra / gUeRro ; fURno), English bURning, Arabic أور & Hebrew אור (OR/AVR is light אוֹר & UR אוּר is fire), ‑UR is a very bad ending)
  • D to VD (deka vdeka)
  • ‑OJA to ‑ONJA (shqypoja, shqyponja ; zoja zonja)
  • US me UES (ms‧us mës‧ues, re‑ag‧us re‑ag‧ues)
  • UJ me UAJ (gruja gruaja ; rujtun ruajtur)
  • Y to I (hyp hip ; hina hyra ; Shqypni Shqipëri) {be‑cause of mod‑ern Greek pro‑nunciation of ypsilon be‑coming ipsilon}
  • Ê to I {be‑cause of Hêta be‑coming Hita : Tem Tim ; Jêmja Im}
  • Tosks change the end of word with N with R (femën femër from FEMINA ; zotni zotëri, botnor botror botëror ; burrni burrëri ; bërë banë ; an‑mik ar‑mik from IN‑IMIC‧US...

I'm a Shqyptar Shkupjan Gheg and truly I don't like to learn & use the standard Shqip based on Tosk for me this language is a total falsi‑fication of our ancient words & my origin. I'm very sad that in Kosovo they beginned to use the standard in Tele‑vision & media, this is a re‑jection of the Gheg root that we have... I don't want our di‑stinctive dia‑lect to dis‑ap‑pear. I don't under‑stand that, when they made and im‑posed the standard in 1969, they don't used the two variants for each words at same time, but only the Tosk one (read this)... Une foli Gegnisht e jam i knaqt se e foli qat guh e vjetër... Still I want to thank you be‑cause I noticed that when you ad‑d Albanian words, most of the time you ad‑d the Gheg variant to, and that is demo‑cratic & re‑spect‑full... Mangêzd (talk) 21:50, 8 June 2015 (UTC)

This is my talk page and I discuss issues on Albanian language!! I have already made myself clear and I have neither the will nor the time to be further dragged in nonsensical religious debates. I have answered you more than I had to. Now stop writing me about religious issues or I will report you at once! Thank you! Etimo (talk) 09:47, 25 June 2015 (UTC)

Ok, I don't see why you should re‑port me for just re‑sponding to your out‑rageous false al‑legations about the i‑slam, the actual Ghegs identity & cultures, the Arabs, the Ottomans and terms origins & re‑movals in Standard Shqip... You are threatening me for using my law‑full & right‑full free‑dom of tough & speech U.S First Amendment and U.N Human Right article 18 & 19. But by censuring & de‑leting our dis‑cussion you show you real dis‑simulator in‑trans‑igent un‑tolerant nature of pro‑Romano‑Byzantine anti‑Turko‑Perso‑Arabs and anti‑Albanian mu‑slims. At least have the courage of your opinions by keeping them public. I will not talk with you about this any‑more, so don't re‑spond to this re‑ply... Good bye, ditën e mir, Zoti të rujt. Mangêzd (talk) 10:20, 25 June 2015 (UTC)

Truth sometimes is outrageous, I know, but someone has to say it! It hurts you because you understand NOTHING of Turkish and Saudi Arabian politics in the Balkan and neither about Albanian history and culture in general! I deleted the conversation not because of censorship, but AGAIN, because this is an etymological dictionary which discusses linguistic issues, not religious ones, and I have absolutely no intention to clog my talk page with your islamic propaganda and verses of Kuran!!! You dragged me into a religious discussion (as I've noted many Albanian muslims like to do no matter the context) disguised as a linguistic one, and I replied you, as I always do with everyone. This is no place for preaching religion. I repeat it for the last time (this time for real): your views on Albanian language, culture and identity are totally unscientific, unreal and distorted through the religious loop you see it. This simple fact is backed by Albanology itself! Nice talking to you Etimo (talk) 13:42, 25 June 2015 (UTC)
@Etimo: I think the best thing you can do is stop responding. That may be psychologically hard to do, but is worth trying. --Dan Polansky (talk) 20:17, 25 June 2015 (UTC)

Bardhyl Demiraj[edit]

Mirdita, Etimo, po sho se do er, pi shton "reference" prej Bardhyl Demiraj, a e ki at libër në "PDF", a ekziston variant Anglisht i asaj libër, a veç Gjermanisht ? A e nje ni "link" ? Faliminerës... Mangêzd (talk) 08:11, 9 June 2015 (UTC) Etimo (talk) 16:58, 10 June 2015 (UTC)

Po me vje keq amã qat faq i perdor proto-albanian, shka e ka imagjinu Rusi Israiljan Vladimiri Oreli, nuk i besoj ato menime, e sdu mi përdor... Kam nevoj për link prej etimo-log shqyptar, prej Shqypnijës, Makedonijës, Malit Zi, a Kosovës... Mangêzd (talk) 20:24, 10 June 2015 (UTC)

Po sho se shpesh pi vnon flajt Gegnisht në "Alternative forms", a ki ni fjalor i vjetër a ni link për "reference" ?

E kam ble ni libër prej Greqiës "ΤΣΟΠΑΝΗΣ ΚΩΝΣΤΑΝΤΙΝΟΣ : ΑΡΒΑΝΙΤΙΚΟ ΛΕΞΙΚΟ", a ty i kam gjet në Biblio‑grafi ni libër i vjetër Shkodrës (Fialuur i voghel Sccyp e ltinisct (Small Dictionary of Albanian and Latin), page 1, by P. Jak Junkut, 1895, Sckoder), me fjalt Geg, amã asnji fjal me C [ts] spo sho në tã, e shum çera mungojn... Libra çera shka jan në "reference" si kam gjet në ARCHIVE.ORG, e kam ni fjalor çe thirët "DICTIONARIVM LATINO EPIROSTICVM 1635" e kam gjet ktũ, po kërkoj fjalor vjetër me shkrim Arvanite (Grekisht) me përkthim Latinisht, edhe Gheg me shkrim Arabisht me përkthim latinisht, a ekzistojnë ato librat ? A kan shkru libra komparative Shoqëri e të shtypurit shkronjavet shqip a dikush çetër ? A din dishka ? Mangêzd (talk) 10:07, 12 June 2015 (UTC)