Talk:文學

From Wiktionary, the free dictionary
Jump to navigation Jump to search

This is first on the Mair, SPP (1992) list of round-trip words [1]. Hongthay (talk) 06:44, 11 April 2016 (UTC)[reply]

@Hongthay I don't think this is convincing enough. The first one in their list, 文學, seems problematic to me already. There is a complete lack of analyses listing all the relevant citations of 文學 around the time of claimed "coinage" or "calquing", and comparisons of how the senses have changed after the coinage/calquing. Instead it simply lists the meaning of "文學" as "writing and learning", when Classical Chinese 文學 was quite complex in semantics already. Literature is "written works (especially those considered of superior or lasting artistic merit)", and one of the ~10 senses of 文學 in Classical Chinese is "泛指文章經籍":
《顏氏家訓》(420 - 581):
東萊王韓晉明篤好文學，疑彼製作，多非機杼，遂設讌言，面相討試。
《金樓子》(554):
帝美須髯，隆準，容受直言，好謀多欲，平秦楚之難，撥亂反正，雖不脩文學，而性明達聰。
居雞籠山西邸，集學士抄五經百家，依《皇覽》列為《四部要略》千卷；招致名僧講論佛法，造經唄新聲，道俗之盛，江左未有也。好文學，我高祖、王元長、謝元暉、張思光、何憲、任昉、孔廣、江淹、虞炎、何僩、周顒之儔，皆當時之傑，號士林也。
《水經注》:
當戰國之時，以齊宣王喜文學，遊說之士鄒衍、淳于髡、田駢、接子、慎到之徒七十六人，皆賜列第，為上大夫，不治而論議，是以齊稷下學士復盛，且數百十人。
《三國志》(265 - 300):
其令郡國各修文學，縣滿五百戶置校官，選其鄉之俊造而教學之，庶幾先王之道不廢，而有以益於天下。
初，帝好文學，以著述為務，自所勒成垂百篇。
...
These are just some of the examples I could find on Ctext, although Ctext is far from a comprehensive collection of ancient Chinese literature. I think we need to review all the words listed to be wasei kango or otherwise repurposed in Japan. If there is no published literature proposing the wasei kango origin of a word after thoroughly examining the literature and the change in semantics, we should remove the respective etymology, for the reason that making a claim is easy (as in this case) and the claim is many times demonstrably not correct. Wyang (talk) 07:19, 1 March 2017 (UTC)[reply]
Thanks for your explanation and attention. I am getting the feeling that there is no definitive source or listing of all wasei kango etc and it would be quite a task to make one. A review seems quite reasonable. Hongthay (talk) 21:21, 1 March 2017 (UTC)[reply]
@Hongthay Thanks for the reply! I created a list below based on Category:Chinese terms derived from Japanese. The list hasn't been checked thoroughly - some of the etymologies of terms in the list may be obvious. For others, it would be good if we could start listing the reference for their wasei kango origin, so that we could check whether the etymology could be deemed reliable. Wyang (talk) 23:07, 2 March 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Review of wasei kango and other Japanese-origin words[edit]

Retrieved from "https://en.wiktionary.org/w/index.php?title=Talk:文學&oldid=42370128"